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Funding Query


mps09
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Ok - so here's the situation....

 

we have family attend for 6 hours each Monday and Tuesday, they claim just 10 hours with us and are charged for 2 hours each week.

Because we were closed yesterday for hte Bank Holiday, mum has asked for yesterdays 6 hours funding to be applied to later weeks in the term.....

 

Is this right? because it sounds really confusing to me!!!!

 

Anybody explain in simple terms why this would be right? or not right? my mind is about to explode!

 

Am I looking at this too deeply?

Thank you in advance!

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No way Jose - would be my take on this! :ph34r:

Why would she even imagine that she could have that - so I take it you won't have charged the 2 hours this week - that's as far as it would go for me!

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Not sure if your county is the same as ours but they don't actually fund for bank holidays anyway..... If you look at the parent/carer form that the parents sign, ours has a calendar for the term at the top and coloured squares are not funded by county - bank holidays are coloured so therefore not funded so they haven't lost any funding it will all work out later in the term as you can only claim a certain amount of hours anyway - not sure if that makes sense or not?!?!?!

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We say they can't but I think technically they are meant to be allowed to (in our county anyway) as as if they are doing a Monday they 'miss out' with bank hols. We say no though and would argue with the council as we are full and no way would we be able to fit those Monday children in on another day - my take is they know the bank holidays and choose a Monday so tough!! Thankfully everyone has just accepted and not questioned too deeply!!!

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Guess what?? I had two parents today telling me that as their children missed yesterday, they will take the hours later this week. I started to say that I didn't think I had to, but something stopped me. I telephoned the lovely lady who is in charge of funding and she told me that YES, I do have to honour the hours, it doesn't have to be this week, but so long as I have spaces and can do it, then I must. Good job i kept my mouth shut then ( which isn't like me!) :(

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We are finishing our term on a Monday for funded term time children so that I didn't have an issue with parents asking (although I did anyway!) I have got about 60 children who come on a Monday who are funded and I do not have the spaces to swap them!!!

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Thank you for your answers - it is the same as I was thinking!

 

She actually doesn't want to swap her hours, she wants me to add the funded hours to the next few weeks, so child will attend for 12 and have 12 funded instead of 10 for the next 3 weeks so she's still had her 'free' 6 hours from yesterday!

 

Still confused?

 

:blink: :ph34r: :blink:

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Well, we wont be compensating them, dont have the spaces for them- far too many and it would be a logistical nightmare to even try to. If you are open for five mornings per week and the child attends for five mornings, how are you supposed to fit them in. I'm not sure that we are funded for it anyway.?

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I have been told we MUST do it for the Bank Holidays. I guess the answer with the parent who wants to add those hours to other weeks is yes, she can have them. BUT, i would not want to lose the paid for hours, so maybe you can tell her she will have to fit the FE hours in somewhere else, she can't have them to cover the normal paid for hours.

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As a term time only setting the only bank holiday that usually has an impact on us is the May Day holiday (this year it was also the Easter Monday bank holiday as well). Funding for this has been variable in that one year we were not funded and then another year we were!

My LA told us that if the bank holiday is funded we are meant to offer the "lost" hours on additional sessions - my argument was that we could not do that for all the funded children that attend on a Monday (as we were fortunate to be full on all days) and if we couldn't do it for all of the children then we couldn't do it for one. The LA agreed that.

This year to "compensate" for the lost hours we aren't finishing until Tuesday July 22 to make up for the bank holiday closures.

One year I had a parent query their 570 hours entitlement to the minute for their twins. They only accessed the 15 hours so everything was completely free. However by the time you included their coming to other ad hoc events on non-session days such as Xmas parties, Nativity Plays and outings things levelled out in the end. Most parents are not that picky but we now make sure that we make it crystal clear that attendance at these events can count as funded hours. With funding levels so poor we can no longer afford to "give away" time - especially if some people are going to try to "trip us up" over hours queries.

It is a shame that we have to be like this but the funding has given some such a sense of "entitlement" that they truly believe that they are able to have it all their way having not only their 570 hours but also being able to access ad-hoc sessions and other events for zilch.

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I think we still get it , though this has got me thinking ....will have to check now, we never have to say how many hours are actually funded on Mondays so they wouldn't know how many hours to deduct anyway, I've had a couple who are over hours say they don't owe, but I only let them get away with that if the extra hours they last took up to take them over funding are Mondays , so if say a fri pm was the last hours they took up then that's the hours they're paying for not Mondays because it suits that week, and like you say it usually evens out with events.

 

Interested to know though, if children who don't use all their hours come along to events on not their days do you/ can we claim the extra hours ?

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Interested to know though, if children who don't use all their hours come along to events on not their days do you/ can we claim the extra hours ?

We couldn't here in sunny Kent - once the headcount has been submitted that's it - so other 'events' are foc for my children - I'm actually perfectly happy with that - it's all a bit 'swings and roundabouts' - at the moment I have one little chap who is recovering from an op - so he has missed so much time - time that I have been 'funded' for...........all seems fair enough to me - I still have my staff to pay, my rent and all the other (numerous) overheads - however, as I knew (roughly) how long he would be off I have used his days to offer to other funded children (those that don't claim their full 15 hours) and I know of at least one child who will be off on their hols for the whole of July so that means he can have their hours........ :1b

Edit to say - I've just read that through and I reckon that's as clear as.............mud! xD

Edited by sunnyday
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remember though that parents are entitled to 570 hours...but they don't have to take it with you...they can go elsewhere. so if you can only offer them 560 hours they can go and'spend' their 10 hours with someone else! (not likely but possible!)

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I've also found out something else I wasn't aware of (well my county anyway), I have children that I claimed 2 year funding for spring for, but parents have told me they are no longer entitled this term due to changes in circumstances, I was contacted by county to tell me I could no longer cross county claim for 2 year olds and had to apply to county lived in (obviously didn't read the paperwork) but it also came up that once 2 year olds are awarded funding it stays in place regardless of no longer meeting the criteria under which it was first awarded :0

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Am I the only one who wishes the NEG had never been 'invented'! :ph34r:

It may be hugely beneficial to parents - but it causes one heck of a headache for providers.........to say nothing of the inability to set ones own fees........ :(

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We have been told that we don't have to allow them to transfer their hours after a bank holiday closure - thank goodness as would be a logistical nightmare!! On the same issue though, we offer 2 weeks fee free for holidays as we are open all year round. One parent today queried why on her monthly invoice she wasn't getting a rebate. The answer was that the holiday fell on a funded day, not a fee paying day. She is now arguing that she should be able to transfer the free hours - HELP!! Anyone got any advice here?

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By the way Sunnyday, I don't wish it had never been invented as it does help parents, but they should stop pretending that it's 'free,' call it a subsidy and allow us to charge top ups!! Simples! I think that nurseries around the country need to unite and march on Westminister!!

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Interested to know though, if children who don't use all their hours come along to events on not their days do you/ can we claim the extra hours ?

 

We couldn't as most times we would have had to claim too far in advance to know and missed our headcount day. I'm afraid we now just charge for any extra sessions they do.

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Blondie1 we had this before, think you need to be very clear in your policies how you deliver the funded and non funded hours. Ours has always been funded hours first, then any other fees due.

Have to say our particular child in question had way over in terms of extra hours for sports day, concerts, trips out, parties but the parent still asked for a rebate.:)

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Like Fredbear we also have a fees policy. Almost all of our children access only the funded entitlement but for the couple that don't our policy states that the first 15 hours of the week that a child attends are funded.

Some of the full day care settings in my area nail it down to which hours each day are funded and the other hours are at their normal rates

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We say funding has to be taken earliest in week too so if they do full time their funded days are mon, tues, weds and they can only have funding between 9:30-12:00 and 1:00-3:30. They can claim for lunch to join up but very few do. We are full day care x

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We say funding has to be taken earliest in week too so if they do full time their funded days are mon, tues, weds

So parents have to pay for a child attending on Thursdays and Fridays only (e.g. if you are full on the first three days)? Is your LA OK with that?

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