Another bash!

[finleysmaid]

not really sure why STC are getting involved in this ....

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/pa/article-3514821/Save-The-Children-calls-qualified-teacher-nursery.html

 

 

 

[narnia]

Obvious, isn't it?? Because we here in the EY sector are stunting chidren's development and language acquisition by letting them PLAY. How very dare we??

[Fredbear]

Me neither. I am quite insulted by the assumption that only by having a teacher within EYFS can they adequately provide the education and in my humble opinion more importantly the nurturing care of young children.

What do they think we have been doing all these years.

 

Here we go again with the ratio debate.:(

 

Sorry rant over.

[zigzag]

I watched the interview on the news this morning and what they are asking for is what all good early years practitioners do everyday (or should do) I really do not see the need to bring in qualified teachers, because let's face it there are some less than satisfactory teachers out there. I have been a qualified BTEC nursery nurse since 1992, with only three years break to have my children and really am starting to resent the thinking by the government that I am not appropriately qualified to do my job.

 

As the nursery manager on the news said, they need to look at the quality of the actual course content and length of study that students now go through. In my experience it is shocking how quickly and with how little in depth training and understanding that level three's are now being churned out into the workforce. This is what they need to address's.

 

Let our children learn through play and in a nurtured environment with people who understand and care for them and in small ratios, not by a teacher who will be able to have a huge ratio and will probably be under constant government pressure to meet ridiculous targets.

 

This has really got my back up and I do not understand why STC are getting involved in this either. This may be one more nail in my childcare future, I fear that I may be running out of nails!

[finleysmaid]

this from the STC website...interesting to not that none of the experts are from early learning backgrounds...how much do they know about what we do???have they asked us...been in our settings.....?

and where does the figure of 130,000 children come from?

 

 

http://www.savethechildren.org.uk/2016-03/leading-scientists-warn-failure-stimulate-toddlers%E2%80%99-brains-could-affect-quality-life-whole

[Fredbear]

It apparently comes from the Foundation Stage Profile statistics.

This is stated at the bottom of your posted article link.

[finleysmaid]

It apparently comes from the Foundation Stage Profile statistics.

This is stated at the bottom of your posted article link.

 

um yes just found this...may I just remind people that this is at the end of their first year in school so surely this should also be about their entry in to school not just pre-school education?

 

of course those figures also include a huge amount of children with EAL or SEN needs which might skew the figures too!

[eyfs1966]

I would like to see the theory and the evidence that states that pre schools with EYT's leading practice give better outcomes than those without Certainly in my area, there is no measured analysis of children's outcomes based on where they went to preschool, nor any measure against whether they were or were not taught by an EYT. I also fear that some of the Dept of Ed statistics are somewhat skewed. I have to wonder of the increase in the graduate led workforce, how much of the increase is due to those who already held level 6 or above qualifications simply taking the EYPS/EYTS course. I certainly am one of thsoe, and frankly the EYPS taught me just about nothing at all.....

 

Yes, I am an EYP, yes, I'd love to be paid a graduate wage, and yes, I do feel that the workforce has in the past been served by some fairly poor qualification routes (ie the colleges who still now push their least able students onto health and social care and childcare courses). However, I only have one pair of hands,and one pair of eyes, and I rely on the excellence of the rest of my team to deliver the very best to the young children in our care. I am not, nor know of any EYT or EYP who is a miracle worker, and yet this seems to be the element of "magic" in early years that STC want.

[sunnyday]

'Another bash' - what a brilliant way to describe this..........I for one am sick to death of these stories.......

 

What on earth do these people think is going on in our settings?

 

Perhaps they would be better employed in bringing an understanding of, and an improvement to, the current system for obtaining extra help for children that need it

[GFCCCC]

I am pretty fed up about all this. We all work so very hard in this underfunded, undervalued profession. At the moment, most of our focus is on children's learning, All of our four nurseries are close to schools with whom we have good relationships; we are constantly being told by the schools and maintained nurseries that there is a marked difference between the children that have been to us and those that haven't attended nursery as ours are settled and ready to learn. We have had our praises sung by ofsted for our partnership with parents and our home learning project as well as for our commitment to training staff in supporting early language. We have files full to bursting of feedback forms from parents praising the achievements of their children in nursery and the support they have been given. Judging by what I read on here, most of you are similarly working hard and doing well and feel rightfully proud of your staff and their achievements. There are certainly some challenges in our sector at present but these are not caused by lack of understanding of children's needs or commitment to meeting them.

• We are constantly being asked to include children with additional needs who may previously have been able to attend (one of the now depleted) specialist provisions; and whilst this is a positive experience in many ways for all the children in nursery and the staff, and it increases parental choice, it is nevertheless grossly underfunded and the level of support available for staff who are not specially trained is decreasing all the time through public sector cuts.
• An increasing number of children have English as a second language and in many cases, their parents can't speak English either - this adds to the pressure put on our staff in relation to children's learning and adds an extra dimension when trying to support those parents.
• The additional funding which has recently (and somewhat grudgingly) been awarded to the PVI sector for EYPP is significantly less than that given to the maintained sector - but we are expected to work miracles with it - and show exactly how we have have spent it (almost to the extent of changing a child's life in one term!).
• For many of us - our toddler rooms were previously full of children with working parents who were paying for, and were willing partners in, the development and care of their child. Now our toddler rooms have many children on the two year old early learning scheme - several who come from families with complex needs and a greater requirement for support - we have more children with challenging behavior and more parents who are struggling to cope than ever before. But the funding for this programme is not only inadequate but has decreased in many areas (and in real terms, if not actual terms in all areas).
• Constant additional government initiatives are being added to our workload (re-registration with ofsted, changes to EYFS, changes to the inspection system, Prevent duty) and also, half baked initiatives come and go (such as the proposed change to ratios for two year olds which we had to fight to prevent a couple of years ago) and now the uncertainty about thirty hours.
• We have had additional costs added to our budgets through pensions and the living wage. And many of us are now having to pay for staff training and early years support from the LA which was previously free. Not to mention DBS checks which were free for early years until 2014.
• The standard and quality of early years training due to the pressure put on colleges and the handing over of government funding to private sector training agencies has made it increasingly difficult to recruit good quality staff and the funding pressures and constant changes makes it harder than ever to retain them.
• The academy system and funding pressure on schools has encouraged them to take three year olds earlier and earlier and not only does it leave us with a deficit to our expected income, but it means children are often leaving nursery when another term or two would have made all the difference, there is strong evidence that children do better when they attend the same setting for the two year old programme and then stay on for their early pre-school education; this will get worse if the governments proposals to make all schools academies goes ahead.

None of these things are our fault - we just keep taking on more for less. The government should be on their knees with gratitude that we are prepared to do it. My staff are doing a great job. Yes, the additional support from an early years teacher might be very nice - but the chance of us affording it is approximately zero.

[eyfs1966]

what a fabulious post GFCCC.....for goodness sake please submit it to STC!

[Rafa]

what a fabulious post GFCCC.....for goodness sake please submit it to STC!

You took the words out of my mouth eyfs1966!! GFCCC - we need someone to speak out on our behalf - your thoughts will do for starters!!

 

I get the feeling that we are being 'ganged up on' - this is part of a plot to completely discredit us - can't begin to think who could possibly be behind it..............???

[hopeytg]

Well said GFCCC - I am also interested in your comment re additional funding to PVI for having an EYPP - I may have missed something in our area but as far as I am aware we are not receiving anything extra for me being an EYPP - is it a national thing or just your area?

[finleysmaid]

Well said GFCCC - I am also interested in your comment re additional funding to PVI for having an EYPP - I may have missed something in our area but as far as I am aware we are not receiving anything extra for me being an EYPP - is it a national thing or just your area?

another acronym issue ...early years pupil premium I suspect

[hopeytg]

Doh - getting my EYP and EYPP's mixed up - thank goodness it's the holidays

[sunnyday]

what a fabulious post GFCCC.....for goodness sake please submit it to STC!

Well I thought it so good that I read it out to the poor long suffering Mr S ::1a

[catma]

Isn't this the research that was commissioned by STC? That's why they are reporting on it?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-35476433

 

The well respected EPPE research was the first longitudinal study that did show having a graduate led workforce showed better outcomes for children - this was led by Iram Siraj amongst others.

 

You can see the actual 2015 EYFSP national figures for SEN etc here https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/early-years-foundation-stage-profile-results-2014-to-2015.

 

Cx

[eyfs1966]

I have looked at the research, but there is lack of clarification on many of the issues. As an EYP I do believe that qualifications are the driving force for improved outcomes, but I'm not yet convinced that an Eyt/eyp is the magic bullet.

[finleysmaid]

Thanks Catma for that info ....sometimes rather difficult to see the wood for the trees in news articles (I say news but this is the daily mail so????)

 

I cannot however fail to feel miffed by this......firstly STC might have been better placed spending their money on the crisis' around the world that require their contribution. There are enough people having a 'bash' without their help. As we often raise money for charities and it is people like the ones on here who support them perhaps they should be careful who they upset! I feel they should be supporting the 'all in this together' system as we are the front line for sorting out some of the most deprived and needy children in this country ...again I wonder what political impact they hope to have from this article?

 

the article starts

Every nursery in the country should have a qualified teacher to help children develop key skills like speech and language, a leading charity has said.

 

The teacher training is currently not up to this job...it is there to teach children from the age of 5 in a classroom setting...it does not cover enough child development/sen/or baby care to cover nurseries. A graduate can fast track through the system and arrive 'fully qualified' in a nursery without ever having dealt with a small person. We cannot afford a teacher who would require us to pay them at the equivalent pay to their school position...I also cannot afford to scale their salaries as schools do. There is no getting over the fact that even with additional qualifications the PVI system will never be able to support full time teachers wages, unless we drastically change the way we operate and go backwards to the same sort of systems that the use in France which parents are generally not happy with.

I am happy to have higher grade workers but there has to be a change about who we put in for these qualifications and the qualifications themselves I would rather have 2 good level 3's who have a sound knowledge of early years than a qualified teacher who has never had any experience of a pre-school

Thousands of youngsters are struggling to keep up with their peers as parents are unaware of the importance of pre-school development, Save The Children warned.

I;m not really sure how much we can do about this....those people who send their children to pre-schools may be given information but that doesn't mean they will internalise it and the more we remove children from their parents then the less they will know about child development. Maybe this is more to do with health visitors and post natal groups...though I;m sure they will also say they don't have time/resources etc. Front facing push chairs/prams and technology also have a part to play in this . Of course how are we to promote the good work we do if every 10 seconds the press are vilifying us and telling everyone what a rubbish job we do? Where is the positive press instead of defending us constantly perhaps our leading bodies should be promoting us a bit more????

The charity said failure to properly stimulate toddlers' brains during nursery years could set them back for decades.

Indeed ...a very good reason to send them to pre-school then where if the government targeted their money a bit more we could have the worlds best specialized workforce ...after all we are still one of the best in the world...not that you'd know it from the press.

 

here endeth the rant for today!

[LKeyteach]

I usually access FSF through my phone. I have a bit of time today (Putting off clearing my bedroom!) and took a look through the resources.

 

There is a wonderful resource from Steve about Geese. Think we should all take a look and remember that we need to flock together so that we can get what we want.

Can we start a thread where we can pool our ideas about what we would like to see in a Statutory Framework and then lets see how we as a forum can get it to work.

 

One suggestion from me would be to include it in our SEF or CIF or whatever it is called now. So inpsectors and Ofsted will hear about it and perhaps use it........

[finleysmaid]

Have you all seen this!......

https://twitter.com/search?q=%23champagnenurseries&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjc18y&refsrc=email

[Rafa]

 

follow up with the article in Nursery World - Champagne Nurseries on Lemonade funding (sorry can't do a link).

 

apparently the spokesperson for this campaign was on Goodmorning Britain too! So hopefully enough noise will be made to get our voices heard............

seems like backs are well and truly up now, the STC article was the last straw.

[Joanne123]

Sorry wanted to show my support by liking these posts but my like button does not seem to be working!

 

A couple of likes have now appeared

Edited April 1, 2016 by Joanne123

[sunnyday]

Have you all seen this!......

https://twitter.com/search?q=%23champagnenurseries&cn=ZmxleGlibGVfcmVjc18y&refsrc=email

Thanks fm - I hadn't seen that - tried to 'like' - but it seems my 'like button' is also not working

[lsp]

Nor mine.

[sunnyday]

Nor mine.

Ah - my like for fm has now appeared - very odd - must be some gremlins in the works ::1a

[thumperrabbit]

Thanks fm - I hadn't seen that - tried to 'like' - but it seems my 'like button' is also not working

Nor mine

Also when I reply to a post it just stays on 'saving post' for ever :unsure:

you could be right 'Gremlins' are about!

[Mouseketeer]

Mine tells me there is an error 'storing my reputation vote' :-/ also every time I go to open something lately it comes up saying copy, paste or save image and have to select again.

 

I don't think we all need a full time teacher in our settings every day, it would be very different for them not having the same 30 chn day in day out of similar age, but if this really is going to be the way forward wouldn't it make sense for our counties to employ early years trained teachers that could have a pyramid of local settings to support, they could spend a day or even half a day in each a week giving advice, cluster meetings could be held, it could even encourage better working partnerships between settings, leading to buying in training together etc....or shall I just take my rose tinted glasses off ;-p

[lsp]

That's a good idea Mouseketeer! Now, wait a minute, just like our children's centres used to have in place until the funding was stopped. Also didn't we all used to receive support from Early Years Advisors (or whichever name was used in other area). There is a bit of a pattern emerging. The difference being that these other schemes were paid for by LA / Children Centre budgets where as the proposed new Early Years teachers will come out of our budgets - thats if we have anything left!!!

[sunnyday]

Mousie and Isp - 'like' both of your posts! :1b