proposal for new First Aid requirements

[Inge]

Can see problems arising with them needing the qualification before being counted in ratio..and not being able to find or get them on courses.. never mind costs involved..will it be even harder to recruit staff quickly , eventually all will have a certificate but moving setting without one could be hard.

I know it is a good move forward and we always trained all staff as it was easier with shift patterns to ensure someone was always trained.

The new requirement would mean that a nursery recruiting a level 2 or level 3 member of staff who had newly completed their early years/childcare qualification must have an emergency paediatric first aid or a full paediatric first aid certificate, if they are to count towards the staff/qualification ratios under the early years foundation stage. The emergency first aid training course would be the equivalent of 1 day of training and would need to be refreshed every 3 years in order for the staff member to keep counting in the ratios.

The proposals are expected to come into effect by September 2016. The proposals will cover all early years settings except childminders.

 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/first-aid-training-to-be-made-compulsory-for-new-nursery-recruits

[louby loo]

When I did my level three it included the FULL first aid in the workplace, (wish I'd kept it topped up!) it was part of the course, and we couldn't get the level 3 if we failed the first aid part.

[finleysmaid]

ok ...this is a good thing BUT it is another cost and i thought the government were trying to keep the cost of childcare down? Why does no one understand that if you want highly qualified staff then they have to be paid?????and WHY oh WHY is it that independent pre-schools and nurseries get beaten around the head with these costs and schools are exempt? It is not fair! (stamps feet and stomps off)

( can you tell my lea have not increased my funding ...yet i now have pensions to pay/rent has increased and costs are higher.....is someone trying to put us out of business?????????????)

[Rea]

Finleysmaid, they've been trying to put us out of business for years!

Can you get together with other groups and have someone come to you enmasse? I think a group works out cheaper per person, or get your parents involved :1b

[finleysmaid]

Finleysmaid, they've been trying to put us out of business for years!

Can you get together with other groups and have someone come to you enmasse? I think a group works out cheaper per person, or get your parents involved :1b

All my staff are 12 hour trained and i use pre-med health care as they are just fantastic we spread the cost by ensuring only a couple need it each year ....it's just the principle. I understand that a tragic issue has occurred to start this but schools often have very few staff trained in first aid (i am talking in general i know!) there are, i believe, statistically more deaths in school than in nurseries so why are we being targeted?

[zigzag]

All my staff are trained. Three of us are due to renew in May, the cheapest we can get it is £60 per person. And on top of that will be twelve hours pay for each staff member. I think it is the most important training we can do for our settings BUT think that the cost needs to be reduced drastically. I really am so sick and fed up of hearing people moan about the high cost of childcare, but what about us who are only just keeping our heads above water, who are providing high quality care on very low wages!

[Inge]

I agree it is a good thing, most of you already do this anyway.

Employing new staff that need the training may be difficult if they cannot be in ratios until the training is completed and if there is no immediate available training ?? Do you not employ them and take the one already with first aid cert?

Settings will really have to ensure they are renewed before they run out as well... or again ratios will be compromised..

Eventually when it filters through all being trained it will be easier , but it is another cost that will need to be found , I know some settings that had to reduce this training to one per session because of the costs involved..

Edited March 12, 2015 by Inge

[Guest]

Good settings will have this in place,

[thumperrabbit]

We do and always have had everyone trained, however as of Easter our free training has been stopped this is going to be yet another huge expense on our very small income.

So everyone must be trained in

First Aid

Food Hygiene

Safeguarding level 1

What other mandatory training is there?

Health & Safety - is that just 2 people?

Inclusion - 2 people?

Sen - 2 people?

[MegaMum]

Its a requirement all my staff have first aid and safeguarding.

[Fredbear]

We have always trained all our staff, so no change for us.

[SueJ]

Good settings will have this in place,

Just to be a contrary Mary here (and I have every sympathy for the rationale behind the parents who campaigned for this) - I used to have all my staff first aid trained when the training costs were borne by the LA but with current funding rates I can no longer afford to pay staff to undertake 12 hours of training, pay 12 hours supply cover as well as pay for the somewhat extortionate course fees and I refuse to ask my staff to undertake mandatory training UNPAID. I am more than happy to have all my staff trained up but funding rates raised absolutely MUST be increased if we are to cover our costs and continue to be sustainable.

In my setting I have 3 qualified first aiders on duty every session in a single room church hall with 30 children (age 2 to 4 yrs) HOWEVER I have extremely generous staff ratios of 1:4 for all children irrespective of age e.g., 8 staff for 30 children - I would far rather the children were supported in their care, learning and development by 8 staff including 3 qualified first aiders than 4 staff who were qualified first aiders and take umbrage that this arrangement suggests that we should be considered a less than good setting

[sunnyday]

Very, very well said dragonlady!

I had a real Miss rantypants moment about this to the poor, long suffering Mr S.........

[MegaMum]

No point ranting. Do something. Start an E petition on 38 degrees. There are enough of us to get 100,000 votes and then rhe government have to debate it in parliament. I think we all have had enough. My head is spinning at the moment with the amount of changes happening all at once and the amount of courses I am having to attend, what with the EYPP, Sen, Integrated Health Review all extra work for no extra pay. With the EYPP, its us Leaders and Managers that have a judgement made against us by Ofsted and as usual the DFE havent even though it fully through yet, and it is implemented next month! We are the fools to keep accepting it. For those of you in a Union, what do they say?

[Mouseketeer]

Good settings will have this in place,

 

We are a good setting and don't any longer, as SueJ says the cost once funding stopped became very prohibitive, I ensure we have 2 on at any time, ofsted happy with that, do we really need 6 staff in a one room setting to be 12 hr qualified, a more basic training for rest of staff would be good.

[finleysmaid]

perhaps what we should all be aiming for really is that everyone in our society should be first aid trained (then this would not be an issue) in Seattle all children are first aid trained throughout their school career and then in to their working career. Defibrillators are available on the high streets and everyone knows how to use them (they cannot be charged on a 'live' person) .

We should have an obligation to train everyone....my issue comes from cost vs. funding and the inequality between early years and schools. I am just about to send one of our little ones to school . He has serious medical issues....he is supported here by a team who are all experienced and trained for his needs as we all have 12 hour ped. He will enter a school who have 3 members of staff trained for the whole school .....what happens if they are off/on training /in a meeting/at the other end of the site...etc etc etc . Of course they will put in place care plans etc but in reality it might be the cook who has to deal with him, or the caretaker.....everyone should be trained but it won't happen!

[sunnyday]

 

We should have an obligation to train everyone....my issue comes from cost vs. funding

Exactly - that was what prompted my 'rantypants' moment!

[mundia]

My understanding is that this will only apply to newly qualified staff rather than all staff. In the distant past it was included on most NVQ 3 courses but was then removed. I think the real campaign here is to have first aid reinstated on courses so that newly qualified staff already come with it, rather than an extra cost for settings to find. Consequently when recruiting a newly qualified person, you would probably be asking for the first aid as part of the person spec.

To me it makes absolute sense to ensure that new recruits are fully first aid trained, as I wish I was when I trained, I didn't have to do mine, but I just did as a matter of course because it made sense to (doubly so as I had my own children at the time).

 

The govt have said there will be a consultation on this, probably in the autumn, so when it comes out, we will all have chance to say what you think.

[Inge]

but.. those staff will eventually need the refresher (or not be counted in ratios.).

[Clare_Matthews]

Zigzag can I ask who you use for your first aid training. The cheapest I have found is 85 with tigerlily

[Guest]

Form collaborations with other settings and share the costs.

 

W have always had our staff trained it's important

We have had to pay since last year.

 

May be raise fees to help cover costs

 

Needs must

 

Not all staff have health and hygiene

[LKeyteach]

I did whole staff first aid in sep and whole staff food handling previous September would like to do whole staff safeguarding this coming sep. I have not been successful in gaining funding so have paid for from charging voluntary contribution (NOT FEES ha ha) to parents. Parents now visiting ask me why I ask for this contribution as all the newspapers say we should be free for 3+ age group. I have a part time staff and after school so 20 staff! It costs to show a professional approach.

How I would love child care to be free but we have so many other needs in our society that need funding. It is a difficult choice, but I do hate being made the bad guy by being told that child care is expensive.