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Call it a day or not ?


tish501
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Hi fellow forum friends....feeling down and need some advice.....we have had the busiest week ever this week....new room open,15 new starters....perhaps I am just weary....but need to pick your legal brains please.....a mum owes me money from October 14....£137.00...she said she would be in on Monday 5th to pay it off...did not..I said i would not give her her sons funding form until she paid in full....ok.she said 'I will pay before end of week '....today when she collected her son no money...'.is he funded this week...? ' I said not unless you pay your fees......Our Manager (my daughter......) was on school run at the time....but the mum rang her when she got back......saying she thought it was not legal to withhold her funding form,.I dont know......but completely against my comments to the mother,she has agreed that she can £25 week to clear it,but she incurs £15 each week anyway.This means it will be paid until April !! I feel undermined...our policies state all that I said....but when they are all friends at school etc...a lot gets said there that we dont hear...and I feel that some parents are looking on us as a soft touch as my daughter does not see that they should pay their fees....i am nagging them to pay is what she says....but I pay all their wages....

Another mother owes £350.00.from last August .paying only £20 week ....wont be clear until may 2015

Need to know please 1) is it legal to withhold a funding form ?

2) Am I being too fussy with fees.

3) Do I sell up and watch my daughter run it into the ground after 10 successful years ??

or 4) should I sleep on it...then Sell up ??? LOL

Your opinions valued please XX

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deduct the sums owing by these parents from your daughter's wages..............and pay it back to her as the parents pay up. That way, she is fully supporting the families who she thinks are being nagged by you and MIGHT learn the reasons behind why you do. Result? She learns the had way what it's like not having the money in her pocket...............but you get the fees paid. Everyone is happy :)

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deduct the sums owing by these parents from your daughter's wages..............and pay it back to her as the parents pay up. That way, she is fully supporting the families who she thinks are being nagged by you and MIGHT learn the reasons behind why you do. Result? She learns the had way what it's like not having the money in her pocket...............but you get the fees paid. Everyone is happy :)

Clever Narnia - I like it!!

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my two penneth,,

1. don't think you can withhold the funding part of the entitlement.. if the child is attending it does mean you are getting paid for that part .

2. No you are not being too fussy with fees... you do not expect to collect your shopping without paying for it.. or any other service for no payment..so why should childcare be any different..

the other 2 you can be the only one to decide that..

But you could minimise the bills by refusing to take the child for any hours other than funded until the bill has been paid.. therefore not increasing the bill - or any payment plan should be in addition to the weekly fees, not including them, so the payment must be fees plus xx amount..

I like Narnia's suggestion.. the fact that the parent is not paying would have a big impact on being able to pay wages... so any plan your daughter comes up with should impact on the wages the same

and in future.. we used to give one weeks non payment and then refuse to take the child for the extra hours until they paid...or extension of Narnia's tell your daughter her wages will be used to cover the cost and paid to her once the parent has paid... thinking similar to missing money in a till being covered by the employee .

good luck...

not knowing the balances for income over wages , but would it be possible for a weekly balance sheet to show how income affects the wages.. include all outgoings before the wages bill has to be paid.. may show how tight it can be ..

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Oh bless ya! It's hard isn't it.

It's a new term so unless it's been signed if it's like our LA (a form signed by parents each term which forms the contract, the parent does not keep or get the form) then she can just go elsewhere with no notice period at all, if you told her before the holiday that this is the case then you have not agreed to provide funded care for the spring term if she wants to claim the funding through your setting then all debts must be cleared. You are not stopping her from going elsewhere to claim and you are not imposing a notice period. If she pays then just claim as you would but if she doesn't pay then id suspend the place completely, again she can at any point go elsewhere due to no signature on form. Sometimes it works but hey not all the time

 

I had this not too long back I gave two weeks notice that it needed paying if it was not paid the place would become free for others and suspension would occur, I did suspend all be it for one day as she then paid in full and I said no care would be given for paid care unless payment upfront.

 

As for your daughter if it's not in policies to do what she has said you can make her go back to parent and explain how she got it wrong and x,y,z what you said still stands, however loving narnias idea but if she is an employee you will have to make sure it is in employment law to be able to do such after an incident like this - I don't know but think it can be done.

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Thanks everyone...not new...the same mum did it with her daughter's fees in 2013 before she started school...

Will think on it.....hard to alienate daughter as means she may take offence and i have 2 beautiful granddaughers to think of too....

soooo hard....hope its just the super busy week wearing me out....love all the ideas....you always come up with a fresh approach....

Thanks again...

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When I had this situation after a verbal request for the money 'this week', it was followed by a letter on the last day of the week, explaining that if fees were not paid in full by the following week, there would be an administration fee of £10 added to the bill. If after that week, it was still unpaid, any paid sessions would be suspended until the payment was made in full. If it still remained unpaid, we would contact our solicitor, and the family would then be liable for his costs of (at that time) £120 an hour on top of their fees. If it needed to then progress to small claims court, they would be liable for all costs.

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Thanks Cait,but did that work ?.. Ionce did that at court for about £245.fees owing......savvy mum...put her outgoings in to the court and they calculated that she only had to only pay £5 for 6 months and that would clear it...and i never got my £55 court fee back....reluctant to do that again. my manager thinks that the more you add to their fees ie 10%,solicitors fees etc...the less likely they are to pay anything..You cant get through the checkout at Aldi (used to be Tesco lol) without paying....

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going to small claims may be extreme and you may not get the money back, but for me it would be a small victory as it shows up in their credit record that they are / have had a court order to pay and this can then impact on any future transactions that require a credit check.. such as loans, bank accounts, etc etc... that in turn can cause them a headache in future...

I only had to threaten once and had a solicitor send a letter... didn't cost as much as I expected, but often a threat of one is enough... that letter made parent pay next day...

after that I never let anyone owe more than 1 week before a warning that if not paid by the end of the week in full the added hours would be suspended / offered to another family who were willing to pay for the place . I did stick to this and the message quickly got through on the day I refused a child and sent them home because of non payment... one I called to collect mid session as funding had been used for the week and we had no payment for the extra hours.

Think some way of letting your daughter aware of how the lack of income impacts on the business is an important one.. she needs to be aware that it could be the reason they cannot do something...if not in wages.. extras.. like no money for an item needed/ wanted... cut all extras to the very basics , no additional extras.. I am sure there is something that costs that could be denied until all funds have been collected.. and a reason being no money to pay for it due to non payment... not your fault there is no money to pay... make it very clear it is the parent not paying that is preventing it..

but definitely consider the need to suspend the extra hours until payment is made...and set a policy in place and enforce it so this does not happen again..

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I never got as far as court with anyone. Most paid up,when I started adding £10 a week to their bills. In one case I sent the letter to her husband and he came in and paid straight away. He wasn't aware that she wasn't paying, although he was angry, it wasn't directed at me. I made it clear in the letter that it wasn't the first time, and that a solicitor's letter would be the next thing they could expect if payment wasn't made.

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Hi Tish , we had a similar problem with a parent , we always emphasise that if parents have any difficulties with payment to let us know ASAP in confidence and we can agree a payment plan. Unfortunately you try to help some people and they abuse it. We had and still have a parent who owed us money from lunch clubs , she took over a year to pay it and in the end we got tough , no being mrs nice guy. She wanted to increase hours above funded ones for her son last term but we made it clear both verbally and in writing that if it was not paid weekly then her sons extra hours would be taken away with immediate effect , she paid up !

What really annoyed me was when that same person was down the pub and constantly in town shopping knowing she had debts to pay to a charitable preschool.

Sometimes you give an inch and people take a yard!

 

Having been a struggling single parent myself I could empathise and show support but I never would have left a debt unpaid , sadly not everyone's priorities are the same.

 

Good luck , be from and follow the fab advice already given. Our LA also advised us to draw up a parent contract for fees and we have done that since September so it is clear to all.

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Thanks everyone...have just let her know via Fb that funded hours from now on since she cannot afford the extra.

Our LEA told me in no uncertain terms (to the point I had to change our policy on unpaid fees) that I was not allowed to add a % to unpaid fees weekly.....but even monthly is frowned upon...I dont think the powers- that- be realise the aggravation we have trying to get parents to pay...some of which like yours have flash cars,hols,etc and we are in a little village...too obvious when they are in the pub..

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I am in a similar situation.

 

One parent still owes money from the spring term last year! It included fees for extra nursery sessions and Afterschool club fees.

She is no longer allowed to use extra services until the bill is paid off.

I remind regularly and still no sign of the money, but this hasn't stopped her trying to go round me and book her child into Afterschool by trying to book her in over the phone or at the school office!

 

I also put a stop to extra sessions for a second child whose parent has promised SO many times to pay up and hasn't

I try and be supportive but when parents can't even be bothered to speak to you about the overdue fees it makes me cross. We introduced a late payment fee for Afterschool, breakfast club and nursery and it has put a stop to most of the issues as £25 on top of your overdue money is a lot!!

 

As we are run by the school if the bill is over £75 ( I think that's the amount.......Can't quite recall!!) they will let county know and start court proceedings. Twice this has happened and parents have then paid when threatened with court.

 

Good luck.

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It's called 'taking the p mickey :ph34r:

If you ever read my posts you will know that I am never on top of anything - except fees - my parents are billed at the start of each term with the date for fees to be paid by clearly shown - if they don't meet the date I commence nagging and keep on until I get the payment - that said I will allow two installments if that is needed........

tish - I really hope you can resolve this without 'falling out' with your daughter - no work situation can ever be worth that in my humble........

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Thanks Sunnyday....I would never fall out with my daughter...being able to see her every day and my grandchildren simply because we work together is a blessing most people cannot have...plus this mum is not worth the hassle.....only 6 months to go and he will leave in July ready for school in September ...she never brings her children in unless funded....Same problem with her daughter 3 years ago....and yet she travels miles for her singing auditions....perhaps she gets free petrol at Tescos to get there and back Lol Hope everyone has a better week.....xx

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