pickles37 Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Hello, Anyone out there who has a Deputy Preschool leader at level 2??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Thought Deputy had to be level 3 or above as they should be able to fully take over if leader is not there or not available/sick etc. Suppose it could depend on who else is working .. the person would always need to be supported by a level 3 or above anyway.. would think it needs a good reasoning to have level 2 as deputy supported by a level 3 always on site with them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredbear Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Same thoughts as Inge. A deputy must be able to take over from a leader in their absence, which a level 2 would be unable to do. It must be a minimum of a level 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louby loo Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 I think you can have a L2 if you can justify why they are best for the job- however you would still have to have the correct ratio of L3 + L2 staffing levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickles37 Posted June 16, 2016 Author Share Posted June 16, 2016 So how would I justify this?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louby loo Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 I wrote a long reply that went 'poooffff' as I posted it! Basically I would say someone that has been in the job a long time, and has there head well screwed on! Someone that knows the job and know what to do in a crisis or emergency - someone that knows exactly how the setting 'works' on a daily basis. There are many reason why a L2 hasn't wanted/been able to upskill to L3, it doesn't always mean they haven't actually got the knowledge/experience/skills to do the job. Likewise some L3 haven't a clue! :angry: 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickles37 Posted June 17, 2016 Author Share Posted June 17, 2016 How can I evidence this? If I could prove that the knowledge is there with courses etc would that be enough justification? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louby loo Posted June 17, 2016 Share Posted June 17, 2016 Are they already in the post? If not you would have to interview for the position anyway- so answers would be recorded that show a good range of the knowledge and experience needed. Just make sure you ask some good solid question specific to the role. That along with CPD and supervision records would also add. If it were me I would ask our Early Years Advisor for advice - that way you will also have records of those meetings to include too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy123 Posted June 19, 2016 Share Posted June 19, 2016 3.23. In group settings, the manager must hold at least a full and relevant level 3 qualification and at least half of all other staff must hold at least a full and relevant level 2 qualification. The manager should have at least two years’ experience of working in an early years setting, or have at least two years’ other suitable experience. The provider must ensure there is a named deputy who, in their judgement, is capable and qualified to take charge in the manager’s absence. This is in Statutory guidance so I presume if the manager has to have level 3 then anyone replacing her/him would have to be qualified to the same level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Posted June 19, 2016 Share Posted June 19, 2016 As Klc has just proved on her post about being closed down, it looks as if Deputy has to be level 3 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendy123 Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 We have also had 2 monitoring visits from ofsted. After the first one I received a threat of £5000 fine if I didn't get a new level 3 employee to be the deputy manager (there is only 2 of us and my deputy is level 2). However, she gave me 2 weeks but one was during half term and so no trial could be done at the setting. I did employ someone but after 2 and a half days she left saying she actually didn't want to work with young children!! Just seen this from another post hope it clarifies....... from klc's post being closed down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadOaks Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 The provider must ensure there is a named deputy who, in their judgement, is capable and qualified to take charge in the manager’s absence. Ideally you would have a L3 qualified, over 2 years experience Deputy and although it sounds vague in the Stat Req, it is left up to the provider to decide on a suitable person to take charge and does not specify exactly.. the only actual specification is: 3.23. In group settings, the manager must hold at least a full and relevant level 3 qualification and at least half of all other staff must hold at least a full and relevant level 2 qualification. This would therefor determine that a Level 2 Deputy would be fine.. especially in small settings with only 2 or 3 staff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSFRebecca Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I don't agree I'm afraid. My interpretation would be that the Manager needs to make a judgement that the suitable deputy is appropriately qualified - i.e. meets the statutory requirements - that the manager needs to be a level 3. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaseyLtd Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I interpret it that the deputy needs to be level 3 too - if the manager is off the deputy becomes the manager until the designated manager returns and would therefore in my humble opinion need to be level 3 too. Interpretation - the root of all confusion!!! Pickles37 perhaps you could argue your point as it is subject to interpretation but I would question if it's worth the risk!! Also would your level 2 consider further training as currently working towards level 3 would perhaps be a different thing entirely! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadOaks Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I asked ofsted about whether I needed to complete an ey3 for a deputy and they replied saying no if was occasional. In the email they said about not needing to be qualified which I did find strange!! Copy of what they said in email here: Thank you for your e-mail. In response to your enquiry, please be advised that The Early Years Foundation Stage states that: The provider must ensure there is a named deputy who, in their judgement, is capable and qualified to take charge in the managers absence. In appointing a deputy manager, the provider must be sure that the individual has the necessary skills and knowledge to deputise in the managers absence. Having a qualification may be a factor but the EYFS does not state that the deputy must have any qualification. If a deputy manager takes over from the manager regularly for a few days a week or on emergency occasions such as sick leave or holidays they would not be required to submit an EY3 form. If the deputy was to take over for an extended period such as long term sick and you want them to be able to speak to Ofsted on behalf of the setting, they will need to submit an EY3 form. Pasted from a post back in 2014 from Woodlands... have things now changed? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lois Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 (edited) . Edited June 21, 2016 by Lois Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mundia Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I think the issue really is more about the size of team. Where you might fight your corner that a level 2 deputy is capable enough for occasions if there is a larger staff team and there are other level 3's. But in a 2 person team a L3 manager being absent, leaves a l2 deputy and who? Cover staff? In this case I'd absolutely advise settings I support that if 2 person team, both must be l3, so to avoid any uncertainty. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Yes, that's what I'd do too. Unless you are absolutely sure that cover staff are level 3 or above? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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