Staff holidays in full daycare

[tish501]

Hi everyone....can you please help me...my staff by law are entitled to 20day hols plus bank hols so 28 in total.....but nearing the end of the summer hols.....with staff taking any spare days before we resume totally full status..lol

However do u keep their hols as 20 of any days or 4 mons,4 tue,4 wed,4 thu,4 fri.

I have updated their hols and found one member of staff only has mons and fris,,,,which i wiuld love a long weekend....but it means that to bring cover staff in on those days (after 4 mons have been used)I am in effec) paying double wages to keep within ratio....would appreciate your opinions thanks

[mrsbat]

It's not law to pay bank holidays is it?

 

ACAS says it's not anyway......

 

The law is 5.6 weeks which is more than 20 days? but bank holidays can be counted in that if you wanted it to - therefore actually having less time off during opening hours if you are closed bank holidays - not sure that makes sense lol but I know what i'm trying to say.....

 

Sorry can't help really as we are term time only so holidays are paid in the holidays.....

[tish501]

Yep know what u mean Lol...we r closed bank hols so have always paid that....so confusing though...def

5.6 days equates to 28 days x

[louby loo]

Could you not have a 'holiday' wall planner - you could mark on any no-no days, and staff have to give a months notice of holidays booked?

 

Plenty of big(non childcare) companies tell staff when they can have holidays and staff then have to negotiate with each other! So, you could say 'x amount of days chosen by staff, other days may not be on demand'

[lsp]

Other companies tell staff they must use their holidays for bank hols e.g. Christmas day and boxing day. Do you close for all the bank holidays? They also make staff use full weeks rather than odd days. You could offer combination. Are all staff full time, if not holiday entitlement is pro-rata (is that the right word)???

[Inge]

the 20 days could be any.. no need to say you must have certain days unless the company wants it that way.. then it should be stipulated in the contract.

 

Many companies say you must take some days at certain times of the year - husband often had some days allocated over the Christmas period for a shut down - but otherwise the rest of the holiday due was his choice.. not set days.. in big companies that would be an impossible task.. we chose for him to have 5 days together plus one day off a week for other weeks giving a long weekend every month

[Stargrower]

I almost always have to cover staff holiday so always 'pay double' for this. If staff are needed to maintain ratios then they need to be replaced if they are on holiday. It's one of the greatest costs of having to have a certain number of staff. My staff have to take the five working days that we are closed over Christmas and New Year as part of their holiday entitlement. The rest they choose themselves but has to be approved by me. They can take any days of the week if they work the same hours each day. I have someone who works two full days and three short days. She can't only take her long days as holiday as this would mean she would be taking more hours holiday than she is entitled to. Complicated!

[Inge]

the otherway todo it is by working out the hours due rather than days.. that way if someone works differetn hours on different days you could allow holiday anytime using the hours rather than specific days.. we used to use hours for some staff as it was more flexible .

[Guest]

The nursery I work at now has it that we get 20 days plus the 8 bank holidays as we close for them. We also close for a week at Christmas, so the rule there is we have to use 3 holiday days to cover that week unless we arrange with management not to (same as my last setting).

 

The office then have a "holiday book" which keeps track of who has booked holiday and when. We have a form to fill in when we want to book holidays and the office look in the book to see if it's free for us to have it off. Once management have signed the form to say we can have it, it's booked. We have no more than 3 staff off on holiday at any one time and the only time we're not allowed holiday is the week before Christmas.

 

When it comes to what we're paid for it, they take the hours we work each week and divide it by 5 to give the amount of hours we should be paid for the day. Example: I work 35 hours a week, so my holiday pay equates to 7 hours each day. Someone who works 25 hours a week gets paid 5 hours for each holiday day.

[tish501]

Thanks for that Harmony1985...much as we do at the moment....problem has arisen as my staffs contract (initiated 12 years ago) states 20 days,(plus 8 bank holidays as we r closed)and a member of staff took it

as that-- and has had mostly Mondays and Fridays...I had not realised until yesterday that her contract was ambiguous.....so means i am paying doubke wages to ceover her hols after her 4 mondays...

[pickles37]

Are there any settings that are term time only? Do you 'allow' staff to request time off? How do you manage requests for time off to attend christening or weddings or other religious events or in other countries?

[mrsbat]

Are there any settings that are term time only? Do you 'allow' staff to request time off? How do you manage requests for time off to attend christening or weddings or other religious events or in other countries?

We are term time only and I put my foot down a couple of years ago and banned holidays in term time - the only flexibility to this was weddings, funerals etc.

 

We we being so inconsistent with the care we were giving as so many staff were having so many holidays that key children weren't being seen far too often.

 

I had no negativity to this apart from the 2 staff who literally were off on holiday every month and in the end it meant that one of them left as a policy was written stating no time off in term time for holidays.

 

Both those staff have left now and we NEVER have problems/arguments/negativity around booking holidays any more - best decision I ever made

[mrsbat]

I should just add actually I'm not a monster lol and if there is ever a time where a staff member really can't swap an important dr/hospital appointment etc then I do arrange cover but their time off is always unpaid

[lsp]

We are term time only. Ideally holiday should be taken term time only. Any other requests must be in writing to the committee and only agreed if cover available. If it gets abused then the committee would have to review. It is really difficult when you have good staff, but like us - we are getting older, no dependant children, cheaper holidays? I do know it should all be tied up and watertight in contracts and policies.

[louby loo]

We are a pretty 'mature' team.. ... and actually we do allow holidays and appointment time off.

BUT that is because no-one ever really takes the mick :1b .

 

Some of our staff have children so no term time holidays for them, couple of other never go on holiday, everybody makes the usual appointments out of working hours. If staff do want term time off, they do have to arrange time off before booking the holiday.

 

That said, our contracts to say no holiday term-time, but I do think we pay such low wages anyway- that if staff really want a 'cheap' holiday then we do try and accommodate them.

 

No-one works a full 5 days, and manager I only usually have one or two key children, but I am the 'back-up' key person for all children- so I take over that role... HOWEVER staff have to do quite an in-depth planning sheet for each of there key-children before they swan off on holiday- so perhaps that's why not many actually do!!!

[Fredbear]

Yes we are a sessional setting and I do try to accommodate requests if possible and not to the detriment of the children or setting. With fourteen long standing staff this is normally achievable.

All requests must come to myself or the person in charge in my absence, and not sorted amongst themselves.

Making sure your policy is clear and fair is key in this.

[lsp]

Liking the 'mature' team Louby Lou! When it works and everyone understands that it's not a 'right' it's OK. All the team, including me, do work in our own time which is often unpaid so it is partly about acknowledging that. But as I said it has the possibility of going horribly wrong. It works for us - at the moment!!! I am the back-up everything person. Lol.

[thumperrabbit]

We have a policy of no holidays in term time however staff choose to ignore it as they don't get paid anyway so therefore have said they will just be off sick

[Mouseketeer]

I doubt our 'no term time holidays' would hold much clout now with the 'parental right to leave' ....and they don't seem to have taken to much notice around here of not taking children on holiday during term time

[Foreveryoung]

My team are quite good in asking for holidays and not just pulling sick days, but It has happened twice where I suspect all is not what it seams so I just tightened my up my back to work paperwork also ensure I always write down anything in mtgs were a staff member might mention going away so it's documented also any holiday requests are in writing and went through with staff how it could be a disciplinary (usually works with my lot lol) if it was shown to not be sick but a planned day off.

Parental leave hmmm well I've looked into this a little and as there is no actual details as to what constitutes what is deemed unreasonable by the employer if you had to get in agency cover which cost much more and the disruption to the care provided by the company to its customers this can be a suitable reason for refusal and a different date to be given, also a workforce agreement can be done to elect out as a company (I'm not taking this route yet of a workforce agreement as I think most of mine are blissfully unaware of the new leave and kinda want to keep it that way - I know I'm being a little mean- and I allow holidays unpaid where I can just not at certain months in the year such as July) I use the phrase it's a request not a right! So check first don't book first x

[thumperrabbit]

....and they don't seem to have taken to much notice around here of not taking children on holiday during term time

 

I agree parents don't seem to have changed habits around here either, but until schools start to fine them I don't think they will change!

[Mouseketeer]

I always think ours would be better fining the ones that constantly arrive late in the morning and then late again to collect rather than the family who might take a 1 week holiday during term time