hopeytg Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) It would be interesting to see what happened if we all withdraw our email addresses - I use my personal emai which I can only access at home as we have no internet at work! On a recent training course I attended, which only last 2.5 hrs and 6 'students' there were 2 members of council staff - how much did that cost and was it really necessary? (Apologies for going off topic!) Edited October 27, 2012 by hopeytg 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouseketeer Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 I do think they're banking too much on our good will at the moment...and everyone you speak to is getting really fed up with it...... The one thing I would like to email is the funding app form but our county don't allow that.......can email you everything but not except stuff back as emails, and surely we don't really need a parent dec each term if nothing has changed since previous term. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korkycat Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 We have a little box on our parent's declarations for the three terms so only need to sign each term and not whole new form. As our form is now 4 sides of A4 it's just as well. Until this version appeared we'd stapled our own box of this on to form as like you we get very little hard copy. We also do not have internet access at our setting and everything comes to me at home! korkycat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmwhite Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 We were advised that you can only charge an admin fee for non funded children. Ie under 3's . Every child should be able to access their 15 hours free at point of delivery. We have extended out hours by 1/2 an hour and this has meant we can charge if they wish to stay for this period. All of them stay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopeytg Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I did a quick calculation last week and for 12 childern we currently have receiving 3 yr old funding if we changed our policy so that funded hours could only be used between 0900 and 1200 (which is allowed - as long as you offer 15 hrs a week,you can stipulate when those hours are) we would increase our income by a whopping £4,000 a year!!!!!!! - I appreciate the chances are some would change their hours to mornings only but it really highlights the potential for increasing income if you are open for more than 15hrs a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narnia Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 so.............certainly in our County, parents can use up to 10 hours in one day. I cannot then say they can only use 3 hours, if I am open for long enough to cover 10 hours, surely?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enuffsenuf Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Hi everyone Just curious what everyone is charging for your non funded children, although I am aware it will be dependent on areas. We haven't put up our fees in over 3 years and currently charge £7.80 per 3 hour session - equating to £2.60 per hour - which does seem ridiculously low when the ratios are higher for the littler ones. I have made some enquiries and the local childminders, some who are not qualified are charging £3.50 per hour. We are waiting for Ofsted, but last month had our quality review and got Outstanding, and I feel the staff well deserve a raise for all their hard work, and dedication as they put in so many unpaid hours of work doing setting up, staying late if need be, the paperwork etc. This September, I introduced a yearly £15 administration fee to help with the cost of the Learning Journeys .... ink, enless photographs, paper... toner for the photocopier etc etc, trying not to put up the fees but it just seems inevitable. I know some settings are now charging their funded rate for the 2 year olds, but this seems too big of an increase at one time. I would love to know what others are doing. Thanks We put our fees up in september to £9 for a three hour session. Our lunch club (twice a week) is an additional hour and optional and for this we charge £3. We are not allowed to charge registration fees nor any other fees by our local authority if we are accepting funded children (2 year old & 3+ funding) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopeytg Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Narnia that is what I thought but we were recently told by our Local Authority that is not the case. The Statutory Guidance for Local Authorities says 'Local Authorities should: 2.3 As a minimum ensure that parents are able to access their child's free early education place in the following patterns: 3 hrs a day over 5 days of the week, 5 hours a day over 3 days a week.' Our LA says that as long as we offer 15hrs free we can decide when it is - it could be afternoons if we chose although I don't think that really reflects our parent's needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Well I have 2.5 hour sessions and my County are quite happy with that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouseketeer Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Not sure we,re able to do that, will have to read funding contract again...most of ours attend 2.5 days to use their 15hrs, sure there'd be uproar if we said they could only claim 9hrs for the 3 morns and had to pay 6hrs for afternoons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopeytg Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I agree mouse63 - although we desperately need the money having made £7,000 loss last year, I do not think it is fair to impose on current parents so all new starts will start understanding the new hours. To be fair we will still be offering 15hrs a week free and if they chose to attend outside of those hours it is their choice as long as it is made clear when they start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Not sure we,re able to do that, will have to read funding contract again...most of ours attend 2.5 days to use their 15hrs, sure there'd be uproar if we said they could only claim 9hrs for the 3 morns and had to pay 6hrs for afternoons. I think that some authorities may have stipulated that it had to be "continuous" up to 15 hours before parents would be expected to pay anything which would rule out doing as hopetyg suggests, but it may be that authorities have changed this so as to allow pvi's to specify which hours would be free. You really must check out your local authority contract it seems a too good an opportunity to miss and you could get it in place for new starters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anju Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 We are very flexible and parents can have 2.5 days or all mornings or all afternoons or one 6 hour day plus 3 mornings etc. But all settings are allowed locally to stipulate the times they offer the free entitlement; I gather that some only offer free hours between 3pm and 6pm (the 'hard-to-sell times' and parents have to pay if they want hours at other times. I would certainly increase income if I said free hours could only be taken in the afternoons EXCEPT that I think lots of parents wouldn't bother coming to us. It's a bit of a gamble isn't it?! I will have to look into this if funding levels drop for 2013-14 though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouseketeer Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I think it would be a huge gamble too....if you only offered free hours at certain times, they'd find somewhere else to go where it was flexible, and if we filled up our am's with 3 yr & 4 yr old funded we'd lose the unfunded ones as we find all our parents want little ones in the morning sessions. Be interested too know if this works for anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperrabbit Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 We are only open mornings so this doesn't affect us but School Nurseries in our area are mornings only, the 'wrap around care' has to be paid separately - so why should day nurseries/pre-schools be any different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoneyPancakes Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 We are very flexible and parents can have 2.5 days or all mornings or all afternoons or one 6 hour day plus 3 mornings etc. But all settings are allowed locally to stipulate the times they offer the free entitlement; I gather that some only offer free hours between 3pm and 6pm (the 'hard-to-sell times' and parents have to pay if they want hours at other times. I would certainly increase income if I said free hours could only be taken in the afternoons EXCEPT that I think lots of parents wouldn't bother coming to us. It's a bit of a gamble isn't it?! I will have to look into this if funding levels drop for 2013-14 though. I haven't started providing FFE yet, but we've been told that greater flexibility equates to higher funding rates. Is this the experience of those who've been providing longer? Honey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finleysmaid Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I haven't started providing FFE yet, but we've been told that greater flexibility equates to higher funding rates. Is this the experience of those who've been providing longer? Honey Not in my area! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anju Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 A couple of years ago we got a higher rate for flexibility but not recently I'm afraid. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouseketeer Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I agree, it shouldn't be different...but I think all the settings in our area would have to be doing the same for us not to lose children, could do with upping income, (we lost 8 more children than average to school this year all attending 15hrs plus a week, so not good when you do the maths) but not sure this would work for us...will put it to committee, though with children attending all day know what their take on it will be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finleysmaid Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 our funding is based on what we did before the nef funding came in so as we are sessional, funding is offered for morning or afternoon places (not both) so parents can have 5 mornings or 5 afternoons completely free. If however they want to add on hours they can pay for a lunch club(30 mins drop in service) and tack on an additional session to make an 8.30 till 300 day. Our non funded rates are just higher than our funded ones and we do not offer full days to unfunded children.(but i do have funded 2 year olds so they can extend hours) The lunch club is charged at a premium because it's a book as you go service so usefull for those odd days when you need an extra bit of time......it still means that a whole day is only £18 which is about a third of what other settings are charging in this area! I have been asked by the trustees to do 2 and and half days but so far have resisted...traditionally fridays have always been hard to fill so i suspect this would mean the pre-school would be full M/T+ wed am and we would lose money the rest of the week. The way we have it set menas we have a more even coverage across the week. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lashes2508 Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 our fees are as follows - £11.50 for 3 yrs and over and £10.50 for under 3's , we do not charge a top up but only charge for any sessions over there alloted funding. We currently have 2 on 2 yr old funding - which is £5 per hour compared to £3.82 for over 3's 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouseketeer Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Why do you charge less for 2 year olds lashes ? They need a higher staff ratio so cost more, we just charge 3.75 an hr for all unfunded, which is a little higher than we get per hour funded (which isn't enough) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I haven't started providing FFE yet, but we've been told that greater flexibility equates to higher funding rates. Is this the experience of those who've been providing longer? Honey In somerset we get an increment on the single funding formula for opening longer days and being open for more weeks of the year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finleysmaid Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 In somerset we get an increment on the single funding formula for opening longer days and being open for more weeks of the year ssshhhh we'll all be wanting some! :rolleyes: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lashes2508 Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Why do you charge less for 2 year olds lashes ? They need a higher staff ratio so cost more, we just charge 3.75 an hr for all unfunded, which is a little higher than we get per hour funded (which isn't enough) mouse- this was in place before I started , i questioned it too for all the above reasons but its a double headed coin - charge too much and we lose out to those who can not afford it , it was introduced originally to attract more parents as most wait for the funding and as we are semi rural and when schools started taking early years numbers dropped dramatically - fortunately as we do not have large numbers , ratios are in line and therefore no large overheads - i have increased by 50p this year to £10.50 and many parents who can work round it find it a much better alternative than paying £48 per day for 6 hours Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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