Panders Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Just wondering - of those settings who do not use Tapestry but continue to do paper versions with photographs etc. How have you proceed with Ofsted in gaining permission to have them off of your premises so that staff can up date them at home? How have you for instance, made sure they are kept confidential, or risk assessed their storage and transportation. Do your staff only take home parts of the Learning Journey rather than the whole thing? Do they have to stick photographs in once they are back in the setting and not at home? Sorry lots of questions - in the past we have found the only way we can complete Learning Journeys is to take them home, being a packaway and working to ratio does not allow for "time out" to do this work during the normal run of the session. Just trying to figure out the best way to do this and maintain confidentiality and security. If you have been through getting permission and can share how you did it, I would be grateful for any input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSFRebecca Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 It is no different to those settings that are using Tapestry - I wrote to Sean Harford and asked him - I've put his reply below: "Thank you for your email of 10 June 2016. You ask for clarification on whether the requirement in the 'Statutory framework for the early years foundation stage' to secure prior agreement from Ofsted if providers wish to keep records off site, is based on a permanent arrangement, rather than a temporary one. Although the requirements do not specify the length of time providers can store records off site, I can confirm that these arrangements are used primarily by settings that operate from premises where there is no access to secure storage, such as pre-schools operating from a shared building. Taking records home for the weekend does not constitute off-site storage in this context and providers do not need permission from Ofsted to do this. However, providers should ensure that, in doing so, they meet the requirements of any other relevant legislation such as the Data Protection Act (DPA) 1998. Yours sincerely Sean Harford" 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondie Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Our development worker said that we should be remove the front covers from the books as they had all the childrens details on - so we did this and replaced them when the books were returned . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted July 5, 2017 Author Share Posted July 5, 2017 Our development worker said that we should be remove the front covers from the books as they had all the childrens details on - so we did this and replaced them when the books were returned . Thank you Blondie, can I ask, do yours have observation photographs in them too? Would your staff be able to manage without the whole book, or would it be difficult to up-date without it? We use ringbinders, so actually they don't have to take the whole folder home, but do like to have the photographs to work from as they choose which ones to use and annotate or write observations about. I think I can come up with a solution - but we all like doing it the way we always have! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louby loo Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Next year (Sept) I am going to have a serious cut down on the amount of photos we take. Sounds mean and our parents absolutely love our books - however most of them are done without pay in the staffs own time! Parents need to understand this. :angry: I'm actually thinking of charging extra for a 'full book' rather than my planned very basic summary sheet once a term. SEN child are a different case- and they will have full obs. Slightly of tangent there - but in answer to your question mainly the staff write up the obs at home, then stick them in at work. Books do not go home and neither do photos. Sometimes staff come in during their own free time to update books, something I'm not really comfortable with. We do try and have non contact time each week, but something always seems to crop up and it often never happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted July 6, 2017 Author Share Posted July 6, 2017 Thank you Louby Loo. I have to say I spoke to staff this morning and they are seriously unhappy about whole situation. It's just finding the right way for the future. All this on the last knockings of the year is heaping on the pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondie Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 (edited) we tried to keep photos to a minimum as so expensive - we weren't supposed to take photos home (according to dev worker) but was only way we could work. we would try to only print one photo per observation - we had a list name of child date what obs was so best photo was chosen by me to print off -some staff are very photo crazy, take photos of everything and quite random -this way i could ignore some photos . we now use tapestry so lots more photos for each obs and obs done on site, never at home.this has helped staff be more focused i think. hope that helps-if not ask another question :1b Edited July 6, 2017 by blondie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louby loo Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 -some staff are very photo crazy, take photos of everything and quite random -this way i could ignore some photos . This is our problem - also some staff go way over the top with the scrap books too!! I keep telling them if parents want a detailed memory book of their child they could always do on themselves - and its our role to simply check they are developing correctly in all areas etc. This also puts strain on other staff members who then feel the need to add more to their key-children's books. This was all fine when we could charge top-ups etc., but now we simply can't afford the time, and staff shouldn't be doing it in their own time either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondie Posted July 6, 2017 Share Posted July 6, 2017 exactly- our staff were paid a couple of hours but never enough for the work done. it was something i discussed at 1:1's - most staff agreed they spent too much time on photos/obs -at staff meeting we discussed as group what we felt was appropriate for each child each week and this then limited the obs and photos. children would have one obs/photo per week and then anything else that related to a next step etc could be done as well - this then left the staff to actually play/interact with the children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladybirds1991 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Hi As we do not run on a Thursday, due to the church using the hall we run out of, which is a bit of a pain as we could really use that extra day as a session day!, we pay our staff for 3 hours on a Thursday to update their key children's folders which they are allowed to take home and do. They have to sign a confidentiality agreement which basically states they understand the contents are confidential and should not be shown to anyone else and stored securely away while in their care at home and the folders are their responsibility while off the premises. Plus in our opinion it is not up to your Development Worker to tell you whether or not you can take folders home, they can advise but not tell you you cannot do it, it is up to you if you take them home and can demonstrate that staff are aware of confidentiality and safe storage while in their care and to ensure that while running during the day the children's folders/learning journals are back on site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheChalkley Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 We were told by our Local Authority Early Years Officer during a quality audit that the storing of Learning Journeys away from the nursery is a breach of the provider registration and the Data Protection Act 1998. They said that any children's records that are taken away from the premises would need to be kept in a locked box if they were to be kept out over night. This included key children's records taken home over night for staff to update. I now pay my staff additional hours for them to update records on the nursery premises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 We were told by our Local Authority Early Years Officer during a quality audit that the storing of Learning Journeys away from the nursery is a breach of the provider registration and the Data Protection Act 1998. They said that any children's records that are taken away from the premises would need to be kept in a locked box if they were to be kept out over night. This included key children's records taken home over night for staff to update. I now pay my staff additional hours for them to update records on the nursery premises. Thankyou for your post,that very much tallies with what my advisor has said but I need to find a properly secure way for them to go home as using the premises to stay and up-date is not really an option for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
louby loo Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Thankyou for your post,that very much tallies with what my advisor has said but I need to find a properly secure way for them to go home as using the premises to stay and up-date is not really an option for us. This always make me laugh. My thoughts are - intruder breaks into house- see's a locked file box ... thinks 'I'd best take this then'... he then sees a pile of paper work.. has a quick look and thinks 'mmmm maybe not' We get our staff to sign declaration forms etc. I agree it's not ideal for stuff to go home (and as a setting we don't) but still - in a job with such low pay and funding caps you'd expect some kind of understanding from the people above!!! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynned55 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 We were told by our Local Authority Early Years Officer during a quality audit that the storing of Learning Journeys away from the nursery is a breach of the provider registration and the Data Protection Act 1998. They said that any children's records that are taken away from the premises would need to be kept in a locked box if they were to be kept out over night. This included key children's records taken home over night for staff to update. I now pay my staff additional hours for them to update records on the nursery premises. I'm not being difficult but nowhere in our registration does it say you cannot take childrens documents home. Or am I missing it? It's not ideal for documents to go home but really sometimes its just that or not doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSFRebecca Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I will put the question to Gill Jones today and see if we can get further clarification! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 I'm not being difficult but nowhere in our registration does it say you cannot take childrens documents home. Or am I missing it? It's not ideal for documents to go home but really sometimes its just that or not doing it. Well lynned55, I think we need clear guidelines as to what is allowed and in what state it is allowed for overnight up-dates, records returning the next day to setting. Understandably keeping records off site permanently is different matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynned55 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Panders I totally agree, there is a big difference between taking something home overnight to update and storing records off site. I wonder if that is a question we could ask ?? - sorry the name has escaped me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSFRebecca Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Panders I totally agree, there is a big difference between taking something home overnight to update and storing records off site. I wonder if that is a question we could ask ?? - sorry the name has escaped me! Yes, I have asked Gill Jones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperrabbit Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 I was told I couldn't take 'records' off site by an advisor many years ago however I had a change of advisor and she said it depended on what the 'records' were. Some settings apparently were keeping childrens registration forms off site and those 'records' definitely couldn't be taken home. Learning Journeys could be taken home as long as they didn't have addresses, telephone numbers, medical info etc within them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lsp Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 We have signed permission slip from parents that staff can take learning stories home overnight to update. We try not to do this anymore and if possible they are done during working hours. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperrabbit Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 Yes, we asked permission too lsp - nobody said no in my 12+years 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted July 24, 2017 Author Share Posted July 24, 2017 I was told I couldn't take 'records' off site by an advisor many years ago however I had a change of advisor and she said it depended on what the 'records' were. Some settings apparently were keeping childrens registration forms off site and those 'records' definitely couldn't be taken home. Learning Journeys could be taken home as long as they didn't have addresses, telephone numbers, medical info etc within them. how about photographs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperrabbit Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 She never mentioned them! Just that we were sensible and didn't leave them lying about for everyone to see. To be honest the moment I'd updated a folder it went straight into my bag ready to come back to work, I didn't want to see work stuff lying around the house and neither did my hubby!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 how about photographs? I understand why you are asking this my little black and white furry friend :1b however, unless you are talking about LAC, I can never quite understand why people worry about the type of photos that we take at preschool........ Sure someone will come along to enlighten me ::1a 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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