literacy and numeracy skills tests for staff

[Guest Nuby]

templates I could use for recruitment?

[HappyMaz]

HI Nuby

It may be a Monday thing, but I'm a bit confused as to what you're asking. Are you wanting to do numeracy and literacy tests as part of your recruitment process? If so, you need to identify what level of skill you want your successful applicants to have, and go from there.

Would the BBC Bitesize website be of any help?

[woodlands1997]

We just put as a requirement in the application/ interview criteria gcse Maths and English at C and above x

[HappyMaz]

We just put as a requirement in the application/ interview criteria gcse Maths and English at C and above x

I've hidden your duplicated post, woodlands.

Sadly although I have EYPS I don't have a Maths GCSE. Would I still be able to apply?

[sunnyday]

I've hidden your duplicated post, woodlands.

Sadly although I have EYPS I don't have a Maths GCSE. Would I still be able to apply?

Hmmm - I don't have Maths either guess we would fall into the category of 'need not apply' Maz

[Stargrower]

I had to do a Maths GCSE equivalency test to get EYPS. I thought it was a requirement.

We also have it as a requirement now and if I was in doubt, I would ask to see certificates.

[HappyMaz]

Without wanting to hijack Nuby's thread too much, this is an interesting conundrum, sunnyday. The new Statutory Framework states "To count in the ratios at level 3, staff holding an Early Years Educator qualification must also have achieved GCSEs in English and maths at grade C or above."

My understanding is (from the way my College is interpreting it, which might of course be incorrect) that if you are currently employed and being counted in ratio, then this will not affect your employment. However, what will happen if you apply for a new job, I'm not sure. :huh:

[HappyMaz]

I had to do a Maths GCSE equivalency test to get EYPS. I thought it was a requirement.

It is. However an equivalency test doesn't grant a GCSE and in any case the rules have changed I think, with the new EYTS - in fact I think I'm right in saying that they've added the requirement to have a Science GCSE at grade C, and the candidate needs to pass the same skills tests as teachers.

I've just tweeted the DfE to ask if a maths equivalency will meet the Statutory Framework's requirement to have a GCSE to be counted in ratios, so let's see what they say.

[Guest]

Maz, my understanding is, and the way my college is interpreting it, that those who have a L3 qualification started before Aug 1st this year do not need to have the GCSE equivalencies to count in the ratios, and this would be the same if they stayed in their current workplace or moved, subject to the new employer not setting their own terms and conditions. The irony in my college is that mature/part-time students cannot start a L3 in Early Years without these GCSEs from Sept, but they can undertake the same level of qualification in supporting teaching and learning (ie train to be a teaching assistant across KS1) without them. Combined with the change of the L3 to 0-5 years we see many major changes in our FE full time provision from this year.

[HappyMaz]

I agree with you about the disparity between practitioners in the EYFS and in KS1 holly35 - but I think it will come in for teaching assistants too in time.

It will be interesting to see what will happen to numbers of candidates on full time Level 3 courses from September - but at least it will put paid to the 'no GCSEs? Then childcare is the career for you' kind of careers advice in future.

As with all things, the devil is in the detail. Until the DfE says in black and white what they expect from the existing workforce, I'd be a bit cautious about how to interpret the new Statutory Framework, to be honest.

None of this is addressing the OP's question though - hopefully Nuby will come back and elaborate soon.

[SueJ]

I don't have any templates to offer but you could insist on handwritten applications which might help you get a feel for candidates' literacy skills. (Have double checked this post for spelling and grammatical errors to make sure it passes muster ).

For their numeracy part of your interviewing process could be to ask them to calculate ratios for different age groups and percentages of staff with qualifications and then just to liven things up a little bit provide them with room dimensions and ask them to calculate the numbers of children permitted in each room. When they have done that a stunning calculation is always working out the pro-rata holiday allowance for term time workers - that usually involves a nested equation. I reckon if they get the answers to these right you'd be onto a winner.

[HappyMaz]

SueJ: I may never work in early years again!

[SueJ]

Go on with you - you just know you want to come and interview for my vacancy

[sunnyday]

 

For their numeracy part of your interviewing process could be to ask them to calculate ratios for different age groups and percentages of staff with qualifications and then just to liven things up a little bit provide them with room dimensions and ask them to calculate the numbers of children permitted in each room. When they have done that a stunning calculation is always working out the pro-rata holiday allowance for term time workers - that usually involves a nested equation. I reckon if they get the answers to these right you'd be onto a winner.

I felt a little faint on reading that......and then thought but hey - you do this all the time! :blink: :rolleyes:

[woodlands1997]

Sorry I didn't realise I duplicated, must be my phone! The wording is gcse maths or English or equivalent, so you'd be fine :-) As you must have an equivalent to have got on to Eyps?

[HappyMaz]

Sorry I didn't realise I duplicated, must be my phone! The wording is gcse maths or English or equivalent, so you'd be fine :-) As you must have an equivalent to have got on to Eyps?

Can you point me to the page in the new Statutory Framework that says that, woodlands? That would be very helpful to see in black and white, and would reassure so many people I know.

Just looking at the bit I quoted, it is open to interpretation in different ways though - does it mean that since I don't have an Early Years Educator qualification I don't need the maths GCSE? Or does it mean that without a Maths GCSE I can't be included in ratios at all? So confused!

[eyfs1966]

This does seem to have caused confusion. The new EYE qualification does now require maths and english gcse to be "full and releveant" at level 3. This does not mean that existing L3 awards are required to have the GCSE's to be full and relevant. They already are.

[SueJ]

Hi Maz

This is from the revised framework (page 20) due to come into effect in September

3.23. In group settings, the manager must hold at least a full and relevant16 level 317 qualification and at least half of all other staff must hold at least a full and relevant level 2 qualification. The manager should have at least two years’ experience of working in an early years setting, or have at least two years’ other suitable experience. The provider must ensure there is a named deputy who, in their judgement, is capable and qualified to take charge in the manager’s absence.

16 As defined by the National College for Teaching and Leadership.

17 To count in the ratios at level 3, staff holding an Early Years Educator qualification must also have achieved GCSEs in English and maths at grade C or above.

My understanding is that there is no intention to "back track" through older full and relevant qualifications and insist that holders of these qualifications must have maths and english gcse at C or above this change is for the new EYE qualification. At a LA briefing we were also told that existing EYPs are to be known as EYTs - they do not need to take the new EYT qualification or get a science gcse if they do not already have one.

[woodlands1997]

Sorry happy maz I meant in the wording we put out. Existing people are fine, I put the link on another thread on here a while ago but can't find at the mo! Will have a look when I get the chance, it's only applicable for new starters x

[Guest Nuby]

I love this group!!!! I have learnt more than I had asked and been taken down paths I never thought existed!!! Thanks you lovelies!!! X Off to read through the CV's and Applications

[hali]

Are you still with us Maz not left us ( your quals are fine xxx) :P

[HappyMaz]

One other thing that springs to mind is that the new Level 3 Early Years Educator course has an element that is assessed in the workplace. So if you're advising staff about which route to take (or when you come to be hiring after the first cohort has gone through) this is an important aspect to take into account. If there is no workplace assessment attached to the course, it may not qualify as being full and relevant under the new Framework.

I'm glad that this won't affect the existing workforce (although I think the lack of maths and english GCSE may well deter those people who are sitting with a Level 2 progressing to a Level 3).

Looks like there might be life in this old dog yet!