Crb Checks For Volunteers

[fimbo]

can anyone point me in the right direction, we have a parent rota system in operation, do the parents who volunteer need to be CRB checked (they are never alone with the children and basically just come in to help wash up etc etc) are they only allowed to do a specific number of days before they must become CRB checked or are they able to do as many days as required.

[Guest]

With our parent helpers we arrange for them to do maybe an hour or two a week for a few weeks, to see if they actually like helping out, and to see how they get on in the classroom. After a while we offer to CRB our most regular (and useful!) parents once we know they are committed to helping out. With other parents who cannot commit regualarly but still like to come in we don't tend to CRB them, but like you say they are not left alone with the children. Our parents that do get CRBd tend to become part of the furniture and often get taken on as relief TAs.

 

I can't be more specific I'm afraid as our office manager sorts out who gets CRBd and when, but Iknow that's basically what happens!

[Rea]

We dont CRB our helpers, like you we dont leave them on their own. Pretty sure the safeguarding day I went on said you have to CRB if they are in the setting more than 3 days in a month, but my heads a bit fuzzy on that.

[redjayne]

As a Day Nursery all of our volunteers and students are CRB checked ,even if they are not left alone with the children it's still a safeguard for you as a setting ,and reassuring to parents.When the ISA registration comes in to play on 10th July this year ALL staff including volunteers need to be registered with the Vetting and Barring scheme, new staff or volunteers need to do this prior to starting with a setting and it is thier responsibility and staff already in post have to be registered by the employer ( there are timesscales for this ) Here is the link to the ISA document, and you can register for email updates too.

 

http://www.isa.homeoffice.gov.uk/pdf/VBS_g...ce_ed1_2010.pdf

[fimbo]

As a Day Nursery all of our volunteers and students are CRB checked ,even if they are not left alone with the children it's still a safeguard for you as a setting ,and reassuring to parents.When the ISA registration comes in to play on 10th July this year ALL staff including volunteers need to be registered with the Vetting and Barring scheme, new staff or volunteers need to do this prior to starting with a setting and it is thier responsibility and staff already in post have to be registered by the employer ( there are timesscales for this ) Here is the link to the ISA document, and you can register for email updates too.

 

http://www.isa.homeoffice.gov.uk/pdf/VBS_g...ce_ed1_2010.pdf

thanks for the link, i had a quick look through -i think i will need to speak to someone in person, as it rather confusing to me .

if we have to CRB all ouor parent helpers i think we may run into problems - not due to child protection issues, but asking them to fill in an official document such as a CRB will put alot of my parents off - most of them balked at the NEG forms when they first saw them !

[Cait]

thanks for the link, i had a quick look through -i think i will need to speak to someone in person, as it rather confusing to me .

if we have to CRB all ouor parent helpers i think we may run into problems - not due to child protection issues, but asking them to fill in an official document such as a CRB will put alot of my parents off - most of them balked at the NEG forms when they first saw them !

 

I agree with you. I gave an EY2 to a parent helper and I'll not get it back, and she's not volunteered any more. Not because she's got something to hide, just because the form has totally put her off. I offered to do it with her but she said 'No thanks, I'll just not bother'. A great shame, as she's a lovely person and the children liked her.

[HappyMaz]

I gave an EY2 to a parent helper and I'll not get it back, and she's not volunteered any more. Not because she's got something to hide, just because the form has totally put her off. I offered to do it with her but she said 'No thanks, I'll just not bother'.

But here's the thing Cait - how can you be sure it was the form putting her off and not the knowledge that something would be thrown up by the CRB process?

 

The whole business of frequency of volunteering is a bit cloudy, in my opinion - hopefully before the ISA comes into effect they will clarify it once and for all.

 

Maz

[fimbo]

what kind of convictions do the checks cover ? is it all criminal convictions or just specific ones ?

[Cait]

But here's the thing Cait - how can you be sure it was the form putting her off and not the knowledge that something would be thrown up by the CRB process?

 

Maz

 

I suppose because she's a good friend and a neighbour whom I've known for 27 years, in this instance. Quite a few of the Preschool parents are 'children' I used to teach needlework and cooking to at school ..... back in the days

[redjayne]

The CRB checks all criminal convictions - so if a person has a charge from maybe 3-4 years ago for fraud (catalogue fraud is one that came up with one of my volunteers) or shoplifting , criminal damage etc that will show up - the person has to have disclosed this to you prior to the checks - and the agency carrying out the CRB will let you know about the search , and in cases where it is non child related or doesn't seem relevant (maybe driving convictions) or 'spent' convictions they allow you to make the decision as to whether to accept.

[HappyMaz]

I suppose because she's a good friend and a neighbour whom I've known for 27 years, in this instance. Quite a few of the Preschool parents are 'children' I used to teach needlework and cooking to at school ..... back in the days

But none of these things are guarantees that they are suitable to work with children.

 

Currently we don't get our occasional parent helpers CRB checked, but will keep this under review pending what the ISA has to say about what constitutes 'regularly'. However with the prospect of a personal fine for not getting someone checked out, I think we may well see a blanket policy being adopted by many settings because of the perceived risks, even though there is still a debate raging whether the ISA will make our children any safer.

 

Maz

[Cait]

But none of these things are guarantees that they are suitable to work with children.

 

Yes, I appreciate that. Our vicar was arrested in November for child porn and he was CRB'd, so nothing is a guarantee, is it?

[HappyMaz]

Yes, I appreciate that. Our vicar was arrested in November for child porn and he was CRB'd, so nothing is a guarantee, is it?

No, but at least it would show up on his next CRB, and he would presumably not be able to register with the ISA, and so would not be able to get access to children via a group such as yours or mine in future.

 

Incidentally will we still need CRBs when we are registered with the ISA? It has always really irritated me that I need half a dozen CRB checks for my various activities and I had hoped that being registered with the ISA would mean I wouldn't need extras in future. However I think I read somewhere that CRB checks would still be necessary under the new vetting and barring system.

 

Maz

[Guest]

I too had thought the ISA meant no more CRB checks in so much as it would be a "live" check and anyone registered would have information on them updated as it came in. I also thought that employers with a interest in a registered individual would then be informed about changes to their status. But maybe that's a simpler and useful method of checking on suitability so I just dreamt it would be that way!

[thumperrabbit]

So, am I understanding this correctly: a pre-school playgroup who has a parent rota for those who wish to come along and help washing up, cleaning reources and 'humping n dumping' furniture but don't have any alone time with a child, they will have to be CRB, ISA checked??

Getting the committee to do theirs is a job an a half as it is! I think parent rota will be going out the window then.

[Deb]

I have invited a grandparent into the setting to make sure they knew what they were letting themselves in for, on the understanding that they would need to complete a CRB form, then asked them to complete a CRB form. They didn't come back in on this occasion but I would do the same again. As Maz said, there needs to be some clarification as to what constitutes regular contact.

[Sharky]

Thanks for this. It is very useful both for professional use and personal. Shame my father-in-law's solicitor never thought to mention (or perhaps is unaware) that my husband would have to be ISA'd eventually in his capacity as Enduring Power of Attorney. I'm so aware as far as work as concerned that the new ISA procedure was coming up but it hadn't crossed my mind either on the personal side of things with caring for my father-in-law.

 

Sharky

[Guest]

I may be wrong with any of the following because the posts keeping moving, but:

 

1) A regular volunteer means someone who helps about 3 times in 30 days. Most parent helpers on a rota in a preschool help maybe one or twice a half-term and don't currently need to be CRBed, as long as they are told that they will not be left alone with any children, must not take children to the loo, etc (and are supervised to make sure this doesn't happen).

 

2) Those who help out regularly as either community volutneers (referred via the volunteer officer) or student volunteers, or perhaps parents who are thinking of training or just want to help a lot, should be CRbed. But as well as this, they should really fill out an application form and have an interview, similar to the process of employing someone, with references checked. When the ISA comes in, this will still be true but for those who are volunteering without any career in mind it will be free, whereas those who are volunteering for training purposes will be charged the full amount (seems unfair to me as a volunteer is surely anyone who is working unpaid even if they are hoping for paid work in the future). This can be off-putting for some but when it is explained that some volunteers are completely unknown to us and so we need to be really careful, then if the volunteer still isn't happy, that's their problem really. Better safe than sorry.

 

3) EY2s are for committee members only. This is the Ofsted disclosure form for new committee members. Ofsted then send them a CRB form which is sent back to Ofsted to pass on to the CRB. It seems like a daft system to me. The EY2 asks very little more than than the CRB form does so duplicates effort and because the form goes to the new committee member it can sit unfilled in for a while before someone remembers to remind them. It means Ofsted checks the Manager thoroughly but no one else who works with the children and yet checks committee members (but without references), who rarely spend any more time with the children than any other parent/carer.

 

4) When the ISA registration comes in to force, the registration itself is portable BUT CRBs are expected to still be required and possibly phased out over 5 years or so. I think they are forseeing hitches! This info was from an up-date training session I attended recently.

 

5) As said by others, CRB disclosure only shows up those who have been caught, and only up until the day it is printed, and so all the other safeguards (supervision, whistleblowing, etc) are just as important (or more so, actually).

 

Hope this helps. Got to go and watch Great Ormond Street on TV on BBC2 (my son has been treated for a heart condition there).

[Guest]

I think you will find that a volunteer helping out once a fortnight is ok but anymore wil need crb

the isa comes compulsary from nov 10 for new employees and or volunteers. should be able to add names from july 10

anyone going onto the data base will need a new crb done at same time

[anju]

if you can be bothered to wade through it, here's some recent guidance (march 2010) issued by the ISA

Vetting_BarringScheme_Guidance_March_2010.pdf

[Guest jenpercy]

Thanks for this. It is very useful both for professional use and personal. Shame my father-in-law's solicitor never thought to mention (or perhaps is unaware) that my husband would have to be ISA'd eventually in his capacity as Enduring Power of Attorney. I'm so aware as far as work as concerned that the new ISA procedure was coming up but it hadn't crossed my mind either on the personal side of things with caring for my father-in-law.

 

Sharky

Caring for family members is exempt

 

QUOTE

The Scheme does not apply to activities carried out in the course of family relationships or personal relationships. So, for example, it will not apply to you if you are looking after an elderly relative or a friend’s child, or if you are watching the school play or football team.

[finleysmaid]

recieved info from TMG crb checking this morning to say they will be one of the companies doing isa checking - so they WILL do both together - thank goodness. If you have irregular volunteers then they do not need crb's (unless your policy says different) - yes i think it's three times a month too - but you must ensure the children are protected. There are still questions with isa checking but changover begins from July 1st for new forms to be used. I assume that the agencies for crb's will inform us soon!!

[lynned55]

Can I ask if any of you have considered who will pay for this?

We have 8 staff & working on the £60 figure we have been given

it's going to cost the setting nearly £500 money we can ill afford.

However to expect existing staff to have to pay this from their own pocket really seems unfair.

[Guest]

We have considered paying for the registration for the staff but if and when they leave the setting their registration goes with them and we lose the money. On the other hand it is a lot of money to ask someone on part time hours at minimum wage to pay out, even more if they volunteer. I keep kind of hoping a magic wand will get waved and the charges might be absorbed by the good fairy, Ofsted Hey I can dream!

[Cait]

How about asking them to pay if they leave before 12 months is up?

[HappyMaz]

How about asking them to pay if they leave before 12 months is up?

Or pay for it and take it out of their wages over a set period? I wonder if it would count as a taxable income if you pay it for them?

 

Maz

[lynned55]

I like the idea of charging if they leave after a certsin amount of time. I know it goes with them but at 60 odd pounds if we pay it ourselves then we may as well work for a couple of days for nothing. I have nothing against this scheme, providing it is administered properly, but I do think there should be some system in place where existing staff do not have to pay. There is something particularly galling about having to pay to do a job I have been doing for years. I cant help wondering if staff in schools will be paying there own costs, I bet they are not.

Does anyone know yet? I donjt think it could count as a taxable income as it is ont a benefit in kind surely? It's hardly comaprable to medical insurance or car allowance is it

Wouldn't surprise it if we were told it was!!

[Guest]

At a committe meeting last night we decided to pay the upfront costs for the registration and have staff repay it at say £5 per month. If staff leave before it is repaid the balance will be deducted from their final salary. We are also going to pay the cost for volunteers who are helping us out and working on the committee but these won't need to be repaid. If a student requests the opportunity to volunteer for their course they will need to pay their own costs.

[HappyMaz]

That sounds like a good plan, holly35 - how do you think staff will react? It seems like a win/win situation for both parties to me though! Unless of course staff take the view that they only need to be registered in order to work at your setting, and so therefore you should pay. You can never tell, can you?

 

Maz

[Guest]

Well if that's how they feel they can pack their bags and walk! (Bad week this one). I'm hoping they will understand and accept it as it seems the fairest option to us considering they can take their registration with them but that they don't get paid a fortune. I'll let you know if we encounter opposition!