Guest Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Sorry I have searched but to no avail......taking records home to complete..what is the general consensus....in other settings I have worked we have all thought it is a no no but realised that sometimes there is no alternative in getting the paperwork done - I am talking about individual child development records...anyway I thought I would just check previous discussions on this and can't find them....anyone care to remind me of their views.....my new team will not entertain there is another way to do this - my instinct is to make time ...but they (and me a bit) are very negative and sceptical? Your views would be appreciated as always..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 (edited) Hi shirel....we always complete/update Learning journey folders at home and in our own time That said....our EYAT thinks that this is 'terrible' practice...... Would be great to do them during working hours - but just never seem to have time..... Edited September 1, 2009 by sunnyday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I found the same problem so i changed the staff rota to enable one person to have half an hour a day to keep up to date with records etc!!...but that is still not enough time so they do take folders home. I dont really see a problem with it, our folders do not contain any personal information only the childs name x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Sorry I have searched but to no avail......taking records home to complete..what is the general consensus....in other settings I have worked we have all thought it is a no no but realised that sometimes there is no alternative in getting the paperwork done - I am talking about individual child development records...anyway I thought I would just check previous discussions on this and can't find them....anyone care to remind me of their views.....my new team will not entertain there is another way to do this - my instinct is to make time ...but they (and me a bit) are very negative and sceptical?Your views would be appreciated as always..... I always complete all our records at home there is just no time at school. I don't expect those on hourly wage todo same and therfore end u doing most myself. This is not ideal but haven't yet come up with better solution. With regards to paper work I always see it as secong in line to the children and s such it has to be done at home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Well we do take learning journeys home to catch up, however, I must own up to losing one last term. We have searched everywhere for it but to no avail, I have over the holidays re-printed all the photographs, about 60, and annotated them as far as I could be called upon to remember, but all written observation evidence has gone. I was inconsolable for days. There was really only 3 places the folder could logically have been, but it has for all intents vanished. The parents have been marvellous about it all, but frankly that hasn't really helped, just made me feel more guilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 we used to take home until we found staff were not returning them to be kept at setting, and they were not available at all times for parents... they either forgot them or some just did not bring them back in daily or had them at home on day off. I became apparent that this was happening when i needed one for a parent and SALT who came in to discuss a child and we could not find the folder or info she wanted... staff had taken it home and not returned it and it was her day off.. we then said no to taking them home, all staff were then paid 1 extra hour a week non contact time in the setting to complete them, If done regularly we found it was enough time to update with the obs, photos and other stuff needed. Children often liked to help with putting photos in own folders and would often sit with staff when they did their folder. We found many a time they would produce some 'work' to put in it , or would add their own 'writing' on the pages. This made them very individual to each child. Inge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynned55 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Inge this is exactly the same problem we have had. So I have now said under no circumstances are they to be taken home. We have jiggled things around and as from sept each staff member will get one week per half term where every day they will have from 12 noon - 12,30 pm to update records etc. (this is when our children are having lunch) I am fed up with hearing how there is no time in session to do these, yet when I clear time I get 'No it's ok, I cant concentrate in session' Then having to listen to how much time they take to do at home. So new year, new policy. No one to take their childrens records home, everyone will get a week of 30 mins per day (on a rota basis) and no one is to moan about the work they do at home. With th exception of my Deputy no one else has any other paperwork to do at home anyway. Well this is the theory and the plan, whether it will work, remains to be seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dublinbay Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 We have always taken ours home to do. There's not enough time in the day during a session to give them our full attention. There's also the fact that we have absolutely no room to keep upwards of 70 learning journey folders in our room. I am aware of confidentiality issues so I have a locked file cabinet that I keep them in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 We have always taken ours home to do. There's not enough time in the day during a session to give them our full attention. There's also the fact that we have absolutely no room to keep upwards of 70 learning journey folders in our room. I am aware of confidentiality issues so I have a locked file cabinet that I keep them in. so does this mean then are not kept in the setting? I thought it was part of eyfs that parents had opportunity and access to their child's own file at any time... how would this be possible if they are not in the setting? we had an Ofsted in past who commented on access of files for parents and why were ours locked away in setting and not out where parents can access them all the time... we were able to explain reasons which she accepted when she talked to parents who were all able to say they only had to approach anyone to see them. this was where we had to put a stop to going home... and it does actually work... we involved the children who love adding to them as well they cannot do this if at home or not around when they are completed. Inge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 We carry ours backwards and forwards everyday - so that they are available for parents to see at anytime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueJ Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 We keep ours in the setting for the most part but take them home during holidays and before parents' meetings to review them. We have just had capital access grant funding to provide each keyperson with a laptop and digital camera (so no more relying on own kit) and are thinking about (very wooley thinking at the moment) making them electronic. We already provide parents with photos on DVDs (all permissions obtained) so it is not a huge step to provide learning journey this way. Loads of issues about parental access, computer literacy, software versions etc. but hey think of the ICT learning!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 We too used to do ours at home. There was no time to do it during the session and quite often we had to pack away and be out for other hall users. I bought a desk with a lockable cupboard to keep all my files etc in at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 (edited) We keep ours in the setting for the most part but take them home during holidays and before parents' meetings to review them. We have just had capital access grant funding to provide each keyperson with a laptop and digital camera (so no more relying on own kit) and are thinking about (very wooley thinking at the moment) making them electronic. We already provide parents with photos on DVDs (all permissions obtained) so it is not a huge step to provide learning journey this way. Loads of issues about parental access, computer literacy, software versions etc. but hey think of the ICT learning!!! This is something I have been thinking about too........ I am not very skilled on the PC - would there be a way of stopping parents 'altering' what you had written........this is what also prevents me sharing records electronically with other settings.......... Is that a really stupid question - are you all sighing now? Edited September 2, 2009 by sunnyday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueJ Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 (edited) Save files in pdf format will make file read only - which i believe does what it says on the box - no altering then by people you copy them to. Edited September 2, 2009 by SueJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperrabbit Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 We do the same as Sunnyday ours go back and forwards everyday between home and setting. We have no secure place to leave at the setting and the hall committee will not allocate any room for us to have a filing cabinet that is large enough to store them all. All staff do their own folders at home, when I was committee I offered to go in and cover 1 day per week to allow staff to keep their files upto date. They did try it but said they didn't find it worked, at the time I was a little sceptical but now I'm staff I totally understand where they were coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Up until now we used to take them home and do them in our own time....im hoping that a little change in the staff rota starting next week (new term) that staff will have the time and opportunities to do them during the session, with their key children involved if they show an interest. This is being discussed tomorrow at staff meeting, but I wont be there to hear their comments so will wait for feedback from my deputies!!! Im determined not to make these learning journals so burdensome this time, if we do need extra time I usually arrange for an evening at the setting where all staff are invited to come along and have some paid non-contact time.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Save files in pdf format will make file read only - which i believe does what it says on the box - no altering then by people you copy them to. Ah.........thank you.........can you tell I have no idea how to do that!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Save files in pdf format will make file read only - which i believe does what it says on the box - no altering then by people you copy them to. If made in pdf format ensure they are 'locked' or 'secured' (not sure of the correct terminology here), I have a programme that can convert (unsecured) pdf's into word documents, thus able to change , (add/or delete) content. Peggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 (edited) for those who want to do it without the cost of buying a programme to do it.. Open Office is a free download which allows you to do this .. I use it instead of word. I could secure them so unable to open in word on this too.. Used to use it for lots of my hard work so others could not reproduce and claim it was theirs without my knowledge.. Inge Edited September 2, 2009 by Inge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 for those who want to do it without the cost of buying a programme to do it.. Open Office is a free download which allows you to do this .. I use it instead of word. I could secure them so unable to open in word on this too.. Used to use it for lots of my hard work so others could not reproduce and claim it was theirs without my knowledge.. Inge Thanks Inge - I would definitely like to share information with other settings electronically but the thought that what I had written could be altered has held me back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dublinbay Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 so does this mean then are not kept in the setting? I thought it was part of eyfs that parents had opportunity and access to their child's own file at any time... how would this be possible if they are not in the setting? we had an Ofsted in past who commented on access of files for parents and why were ours locked away in setting and not out where parents can access them all the time... we were able to explain reasons which she accepted when she talked to parents who were all able to say they only had to approach anyone to see them. this was where we had to put a stop to going home... and it does actually work... we involved the children who love adding to them as well they cannot do this if at home or not around when they are completed. Inge Yes Inge. I know it isn't an ideal situation keeping the folders at home. They do go home twice a term with an invitation to parents to add to them with their children. It's the summer term which causes the most problems with 70+ children with the same amount of folders and nowhere to put them. This term will be nicer with a lot fewer children and we'll probably keep them at pre-school (the folders I mean!! ). It is interesting that while we tell parents that they have a right to see their child's personal file at any time no one has ever asked, certainly not in the past 5 years I have worked there!! Anyone else find this is so?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 It is interesting that while we tell parents that they have a right to see their child's personal file at any time no one has ever asked, certainly not in the past 5 years I have worked there!! Anyone else find this is so?? Absolutely - dublinbay - I have never ever had a request either - we do put ours out on display at fairly regular intervals, and like you, we send them home twice termly (old terms that is).........but I do often wonder why I bother to 'lug' them backwards and forwards everyday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 My worry would be that even if a parent asks and I could say I would bring it in next session but Ofsted would turn up at any time and ask to see them , they always have at our past inspections and were very insistent that they were kept at the setting. As i said they asked why they were not where parents could help themselves to look at them. Took me a lot of convincing as to why not! we had a full filing cabinet of children's folders ( we had up to 60 by summer term) and staff folders and so much else that we had to have in the setting not at home. Inge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 2, 2009 Share Posted September 2, 2009 Sorry....yes of course Inge......that is exactly why I 'lug' them backwards and forwards.........I do know that Ofsted want them to be 'on site' for parents to see at anytime........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueJ Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 Ah.........thank you.........can you tell I have no idea how to do that!!! Has taken a while to work out quote thing sorry. If you use word choose "save as" and select "pdf". In word you can "mark as final" to make a document read only too - but this can be undone within the programme by anyone by selecting the "mark as final option" and undoing it. I am only looking to provide parents with their children's learning journey stuff and possibly share obs with other settings. Anything stricly confidential would be done using recorded snail mail. As Peggy says pdf's can be undone and edited although if they save it the file I don't know if the file will store the new date. I think if parents wanted to go to these lengths to change something - well hey ho!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyday Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 Oh thanks Sue - I will give that a go! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyMaz Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 If you use word choose "save as" and select "pdf". Which version of Word are you using Sue? I can't see .pdf as an option in mine! Maz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueJ Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 Hi Maz I'm using 2007 - home an student version Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 3, 2009 Share Posted September 3, 2009 If you can't find a "save as pdf" option I have used cutepdf (free download) to make documents into pdf format. Once you download it you choose the option or print and choose pdf if I remember correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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