Intresting...what Do You Do?

[Guest]

Hi all

Well was doing a bit of networking etc at a course last week and got the opportunity to ask the following of about 25 nursery nurses, pre-school assitants/managers tc.

 

How many of you are in a union?

I would say about 20 said they were! (my colleague and I at the course are looking into the union Voice).

 

Do you pay unqualified staff the same as qualified?

All said no. We are paid the same as unqualified staff therefore what is the point of being qualified? Just had a letter from committee saying they realise how hard we work etc but this year cannot afford to give anyone a payrise (so not much chance of us getting a different rate then!....currently £6.18 in the midlands)

 

Do you get paid for updating childrens files?

All said yes. Varied from ours ( 1 hr per term!) up to 3 hrs per week!

 

Do you get paid for training courses?

All said yes. We do get paid although only for the time on the course (3 hrs). Which is ok if it is not your normal work day but it was my morning in and I therefore lost 2 hrs and still had travel expenses and to rush to get back for the afternoon session!

 

Just intersted in what others do? I think it does dpend on if you are a charity run pre-school though!

 

Committee arent too plaeed that we are looking at unions tho! We are doing it more for protection against alligations than anything else.

 

Thanks

[Cait]

How many of you are in a union?

we're not, and can't say we've ever considered it, what are the benefits?

Do you pay unqualified staff the same as qualified?

not at all, we have a sliding scale from Manager down to student on NMW for 17 year old, I also pay additional incremental increases for staff who update their qualificaions

 

Do you get paid for updating childrens files?

I pay staff 1 to 2 hours a week to do this

 

Do you get paid for training courses?

If it's a day that staff wouldn't have worked, then I pay them overtime. If necessary I pay travel allowance

[Inge]

How many of you are in a union?

we're not, and can't say we've ever considered it, but could see benefits ins some situations. As pay is so low the cost would have to be considered though.

 

Do you pay unqualified staff the same as qualified?

NO. had several rates depending on level of qualification and responsibility in the setting... we had to do this as no one wanted to train if there was no benefit to it, why bother if all the effort you make is not recognised.

 

Do you get paid for updating childrens files?

1 hour a week, on site... this could be done as staff wanted, some did 2 hrs alternate weeks, so long as they did the time they were paid for it.. if we noticed the files were not being done then pay was deducted accordingly.. made them all want to do them!

 

Do you get paid for training courses?

depends on course and nature of it, but mostly yes, and it it was a usual working day they would be paid the days wage as usual.. no travel costs though..

 

Inge

[Guest]

How many of you are in a union?

 

No one is - as couldnt see the benefits re costs etc

 

Do you pay unqualified staff the same as qualified?

 

No, we also have a sliding scale according to qualifications and experiences

 

Do you get paid for updating childrens files?

 

Each key person is allocated 3 hours non contact time per week to do assessing, we have extra staff who come in to cover assessing time. The hours form part of the key persons day, so xtra as such, however when I numbers fluctuate, they are still being payed 3 hours per week to come into setting to assess.

 

Do you get paid for training courses?

 

All staff get paid for the hours attending the course, we do not pay travel expenses. We also pay staff starting their NVQ training £150 at start of course and £100 on completion, staff are asked to sign a contract stating if they leave within two years of gaining the qualification then they have to pay the £250 back, they also dont have to accept the financial incentive, but all have done so.

[Guest]

None of us are in a union, and I looked into it but didn't feel for the costs it would be worthwhile. We don't get paid for time updating files, but we are looking into making some time during the session for staff to do some updating to help out on this score. We do pay staff differently but this takes into account both qualifications and experience, as we have had staff with lots of experience and short courses under their belt but no level 3 for example. That said the difference is minimal!! And with regard training costs - we pay for the course more often than not, and we are currently in a situation where the committee plan to look at payment for training time at the end of the year and pay some kind of bonus. This is partly because we tend to do more training in the autumn term when we have lower numbers and so more time but less cashflow, and partly because the LA withdrew a training allowance we used for this purpose last year.

[sunnyday]

My very quick answers are - No, No, Yes and Yes!

[Sue R]

I'm guessing that most of you that have said No to the union membership Q are in a preschool?

 

I'm in a DN, and have been a member of Voice since the nursery changed hands as, if there's any jiggery pokery with Ts & Cs I want protection/support!

 

We don't get extra time for updating children's files, although I personally get time each week for planning etc as I have the lead responsibility.

 

 

 

Sue

[Tink69]

I would recommend joining a union as I have a friend who had a serious problem at work with senior management which led to diciplinary action lost her job! She worked for a very large chain and really didn't have fair hearing and lost her job because she was up against a big company she wasn't in a union and really wished she had been.

 

 

 

Tink69

[Guest]

Hi I am in a committee run Pre School and up until last December we thought we were fine -

In answer to your questions...

How many of you are in a union? = None

Do you pay unqualified staff the same as qualified? = No - 50p per hr difference for unqualified, qualified & supervisor

Do you get paid for updating childrens files? = Yes, 4 hrs per academic year

Do you get paid for training courses? Yes - all of them

BUT...

in December, I had to call in Independent Financial advisor as committee informed staff we were in 'dire straights' and we couldn't go on as we were.

Financial advisor said - we were overpaid!!! (as the Early Years sector isn't a highly paid job anyway)

We shouldn't be paid for any non contact time!!!

Unqualified staff should be on minimum wage

Training funds shouldn't come out of groups finances!!!

Use students instead of staff as they come free of charge!!!!

 

Basically - the committee took her word literally and 2 staff jobs were on the line to be replaced by students. We have since managed to retain our staff by applying for a grant but now we only get paid for the time we are with the children NOTHING else!

Edited February 15, 2010 by Guest

[thumperrabbit]

How many of you are in a union? = None

 

Do you pay unqualified staff the same as qualified? = No - unqualified min wage - qualified 20p more, Deputy - 20p more than that, Leader 50p more that that

 

Do you get paid for updating childrens files? = Yes, 1 hour per week (at home) plus 1 session per term in the setting (as long as ratios allow)

 

Do you get paid for training courses? No - none even if at the weekend which most seem to be at the moment

 

We are aCommittee/Charity run pre-school

[Guest]

I'm shocked that anyone would consider paying unqualified staff the same as qualified staff. As you say, what would the point be of being qualified and how on earth are they hanging on to their qualified staff?

 

Although I'm not in a preschool setting myself I have friends who are and they all say that unqualified staff get only the minimum wage, which is what I would have expected them to get.

[HappyMaz]

Although I'm not in a preschool setting myself I have friends who are and they all say that unqualified staff get only the minimum wage, which is what I would have expected them to get.

I personally think it is quite shocking that anyone caring for our youngest children should only be getting the minimum wage, unqualified or not.

 

We pay qualified staff more, get paid to attend training, do our learning journey work during session time, don't belong to a union.

 

Maz

[Guest]

(following your lead Sunnyday) No, No, Yes (15mins per child per week), and Yes

 

this is interesting to see what others do!

[Guest Spiral]

I'd always advise that joining a Union gives you security when in any job - what if there is a difference of opinion about roles and the management doesn't listen to you? What if there are disputes over pay and responsibilities?

 

Staff pay should be tiered according to qualification and a bargain should be struck between staff and employer re paying to update the key work, or not to, but it should be written down and agreed.

 

The same goes for training courses.

 

Wow, it's an absolute minefield!

Spiral

[Guest babyjane31]

We're a committee run pre-school

 

no one in union

 

Have pay scales dependant on qualifications and experince as well as responsibility deputy gets £1 more than other staff and manager £1 more than deputy. Increment rises given each year dependant on perfomance.

 

All staff have 5 hours non contact week for updating files and staff meetings, all managers hours non contact and deputy gets an additional 2.5 hours for admin duties.

 

Paid for compulsary training such as first aid, safeguarding and qualification training

[Sue R]

I personally think it is quite shocking that anyone caring for our youngest children should only be getting the minimum wage, unqualified or not.

 

Maz

 

I, too think it quite shocking!! Unfortunately it seems that that's the way it is ...

 

I won't say what happens to staff when they qualify.

 

Sue

[HappyMaz]

I won't say what happens to staff when they qualify.

Ouch!

 

Maz

[Guest]

Hi

Thanks to all. Made very interesting reading!

Wonder why it is those in committee run preschool that are not in a union? It is expensive but voice do a range of prices for those working part-time, to those on minimum wage. They also have no strike policy which we are attracted to. We are committee run, 9-3.15 pm setting getting larger (15 staff doing various hours) with 140 kids on roll. It is something most of us are looking into because of this.

 

I agree there should be some sort of tiering system for pay. Good point about experience should be recognised. Our setting has only just got 50% qualified and as we are paid no more than the unqualified staff then those unqualified are not interested in gaining qualifications especially as they have to pay for it themselves. Might be something i will have to riase with supervisor at later date or my first appraisal!! The thing is apart from me all the ladies live in the village where the pre-school is. They are allowed to bring in their children while staff set up and then one staff member walks them down the rd to school. So unlike myself, ( i have to pay for before/after school club for my son )

so this is an attractive reason for stying put at this particular pre-school.

 

As for learning journals, training the committee try their best! At my last setting we did not get paid for meetings, training or journals at all so i do sort of count myself lucky!

 

Anyway, for those of you that followed my time at my last pre-school, you will all be reassured to know that after 6 months at this one I still love it!!!

[Guest]

I personally think it is quite shocking that anyone caring for our youngest children should only be getting the minimum wage, unqualified or not.

 

Yes, sadly that's a whole other story. When I said I expected them to get minimum wage please don't think I meant it's right that they do, I just meant I would expect it because that seems to be the way of the world and settings can't afford more. I would however think it right that qualified staff should get more than unqualified staff, it would be very nice if this could be higher for everyone.