trekker Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Well after a lot of hassle with my ex-chair last year it seems although now 'gone' she can still dig in her oar...she has complained about a ‘lack of structure’ / supervision (because of a slight accident)...which is one almighty assumption as she never ever attended a session to see anything...but that’s by the by...now I feel like I'm stuck in a time loop because the new committee (with some old members) are again questioning the whole 'free play', free flow, amount of adult led activities etc. It has been suggested is that we each take our group for focused activities for an hour a session (say 9.30 to 10.30) ...either indoors or out (in which case the other children in other groups are not allowed out until after this has finished..) ...key staff would keep their group with them (not sure how they would make this happen in practice!)...the idea is this would avoid children having accidents and ensure children are always focused on something....and there was the usual they need to be 'getting ready for school' focus.... Personally I think its a terrible idea and unworkable - but my level 2 staff in particular are all in favour (even after 2 yrs of working with us...) , still insist they don’t understand the planning (though I can’t see why not and feel this is an excuse for not contributing – especially after 2 yrs..I am losing patience really). They feel the children are left to 'run riot' as there is ‘nothing planned’ for children (we list ideas for enhancing cont prov based on two focus areas of learning and a sheet for adult led activities held at the end of the session) These staff consistently fail to engage with children during free play no matter how often I prompt them / discuss the importance at staff meetings... I could scream as I’ve gone over and over and over all that it’s not supposed to be 'leave them to it' free play...it’s meant to have adults engaging, supporting, modelling, observing while children make choices 'free play'...but obviously I’m not getting through. I feel like Im the only one who feels free play is everybit as effective as adult led activites (if its managed right). Once again I am in the minority and being asked to back track – mainly as a result of this complaint ...which I’m not happy to do and yet I feel like just like the last committee this one will come to see me as putting obstacles in the way just for the sake of it rather than for the sake of my principles and desire to protect the children form overly formalised practice. What I feel I need is some definitive article, web site, research – anything that can help support my argument that what we do is right!! Ive looked online but don’t feel anything ive seen so far makes the point clearly enough. Does anyone have any suggestions on any of this..or perhaps other ways I could handle it? Also any suggestions for staff training / support ...to show rather than tell that the flexible, child led way is more appropriate and that its okay to keep adult led times minimised and that as long as adults are actively engaging / supporting children they will cover everything they need to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Upsy Daisy Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I find Jennie Lindon is usually good. How about this? http://www.literacytrust.org.uk/talk_to_yo...o_with_the_flow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garrison Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I dont have any useful articles but i totally agree with you and sympathise with your situation. Not helpful I know but just wanted to show some support. Could you not meet half way and spend a short time each session doing something more structured? might shut them up a bit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Why not put the ball in their court (NVQ2's) and ask them to plan for an hour a day for a particular key group, for say a month. That would make them see how hard that could be and show them that your way of planning is a lot simpler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 An hour per session is a lot too. We have had a very boy heavy (who am I kidding - some days there are only boys!) cohort who have been allowed to explore their interests and free flow up to this point since Sept. We have now started to introduce some focus time which is timetabled (previously it happened spontaneously) due to the boys showing interest in having that time. But this time is only planned for 15-20 mins at a time. If the children are interested and engaged still they continue for longer, but I doubt they would manage an hour. These are boys who have very good social skills, communication and concentration skills, but they are preschool, not school aged. Even in reception classes I don't think they would be expected to be on a focus task for an hour at a time, even in the most traditional of reception classes. I agree with the idea above about getting your level 2s to plan and see if they really think the grass is greener. Also I think Tina Bruce might be useful for free flow play arguments. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucie Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I'm sorry, but I find this totally unfathomable (sp). I assume you are the pre-school leader/supervisor/manager, and hold the highest qualifications/experience/qualities/knowledge and this is why you hold this position. Can I ask what qualifications/experience/knowledge your commitee have? Why are they allowed to cajole your staff into agreeing with them on a matter that I can only assume they know nothing about?? Totally ridiculous! Lucie x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trekker Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 Yes I think 'show' dont 'tell' is very appropriate in this case...I think it'll be a big challenge and children will revolt soon enough ...what I cant understand is that Ive struggled to get so much as a decent 10 minute circle time out of them ... and then they moan that there arent enough adult led activites! My argument is they happen all the time when staff actively engage with the children...but apparently if theyre not planned they dont count.. Committee are concerned ex-chair will go to Ofsted next if she doesnt get a satisfactroy outcome from her complaint...so pressure is on if shes to feel we have taken her views seriously... dont think this is the way to go though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 how about looking up the research on concentration time for this age group being 1 min for each year of their age.. cannot remember where though.. would be worth some research though .. how can they expect a 3 year old to concentrate for 60 mins when they are not capable of it.. and personally I would say let Ofsted come and see what we are doing.. it would give an answer to the constant more formal sit and learn route and the learn through play and interests one.. and stop all the issues constantly arising.. I must admit I was never worried by O though, so long as I knew my stuff and was able to explain why I was doing something . Any issues they had I looked as a way to improve my practice rather than a negative .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panders Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 coming from the same direction as Inge, could you arrange for your Early Years Advisor to talk to committee, parents and staff one evening about the whole learning through play ideas and research, I know that mine would have been very happy to oblige if I'd have asked, sounds like it's time for someone to be on your side championing what you know is right, rather than meddlesome committee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 No it isn't just you! What you're doing is absolutely right. An hour!! I'm flaberghasted. Stick to your beliefs. Great idea to get an Early Years Consultant to talk to your committee as you need some back up. If all else fails, as has been said, let Ofsted come and put this to rest once and for all. We've had a very young cohort this year and have had to adapt our routine even more to be more child centred. We now have half an hour at the end of the session where we come together for an active letters and sounds activity, a story and some singing. Then once the committee have a better understand and will support you and you've tried motivating and inspiring your level 2 staff about the benefits of interacting and extending children's child-initiated play but are getting nowhere, it might be time to have appraisals, followed by supervisory meetings with targets to achieve with your support in order to fulfil their job role? I feel your frustration! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trekker Posted January 28, 2012 Author Share Posted January 28, 2012 Yes I agree some support from my EYAdvisor would be great but unfrotunately I've lost faith in much help coming from that direction after the past year ... I sought help when it all blew up last time but was essentially left to flounder. I will try again though. I do feel that if ofsted come they will see more positives than negatives (apart from peoples attitudes I guess) ..we recieved a 'good' last yr and we are still wroking the same way so it can be all bad. The ofsted report didnt satify the ex chair then either so to be honest I dont think anything less than me admitting she was right all along, taking responsibilty for the accident (because I grant children 'too much freedom') and for the setting to start herding children like cattle and sending home some nice evidence of learning each day, will satisfy her...shes not even coming to the group any more...child attends another setting that does so much more than us...apparently. Still has her spies though. well for now I will look forward to seeing how my staff manage this new approach while my key children and I merrily play along as usual... We have very young 2 yr olds and several EAL children and SEN...I can only imagine the struggle that will go on when staff try and control their movements! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I do think you have come up with a very suitable way of dealing with this.. let them try it out, but as it is supposed to be more formal they will also need to plan and then ask them to evaluate everything as well with no extra time or pay of course..and your relaxed and simple planning for your children will show exactly the same if not more has been learnt in the same time.. it may be the only way to let them realise that it is setting themselves and the children up to continually fail rather than achieve anything.. I must admit to often letting staff have their ideas and use them even though many I felt were not quite right, they either learnt a way round to make it work or realised that it was not working and stop .. a way of learning to evaluate their own practice.. does not work with an absent committee who want things done their way but are not there everyday to see if it works.. I still fail to see why they are not recognising Ofsted and their report .. and why someone is still interfering in a setting when it has nothing to do with them at all.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 as an after thought and this also has an accident noted as part of the issue of letting the children have freeplay causing it.. maybe a bit of education on risks and the need to learn for themselves.. I have posted this one before but thought it may be relevant.. about 'cotton wool' parenting.. risks and freedom are important .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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