Staff Wages

[Buttercup]

I am well confused

 

I am private so do wages through BACS dead easy. You need passwords etc so not everyone would be able to access accounts and transactions would be shown on statement.

 

I pay my staff which are all happy this way 38wks plus 4 wks hol divided by 12mths.

 

we bank with alliance and leicester no bank charges for chqs, cash etc you can post chqs and take cash to the post office.

 

Holidays entitlement is changing in april.

 

angela

Edited October 23, 2008 by angelaw

[Mouseketeer]

interesting to see that some of you can pay staff by internet banking...when we asked at bank they said we couldnt do this as one person would have access to funds where as two need to sign cheques..would make life much easier.

 

we pay 38 wks pay/11 monthsly payments then 1 month holiday pay august with any hours owing to the pre-school deducted from holiday pay.

 

Is anyone paying the 4.8 hours pro-rata holiday pay ?

[Guest]

Another positive of pro rata payments is that it can reduce the N.I. contributions cost.

 

I've just wondered if it's worth advertising for committee members for officer roles such as treasurer. I think I 'll start a new thread on this thought.

 

Peggy

[Guest]

You are absolutely right Peggy, NI contributions are reduced by paying this way, in fact we save about £100 per year individually by having our paye taxed pro rata each year.

 

I have again spoken to our chair, and I have got an appointment with her Wednesday first week of term.

 

I believe that you have to have a professional person work out your paye each year as it is indeed very complicated if you consider sick pay, time off, overtime. At the end of the day committee are not paid to do this job and it becomes very hard to keep track of who has worked what and when.

 

We are very fortunate to be allowed 5 days sick pay each year. The majority of our staff have worked for over 8 years at our setting and have never claimed their full entitlement in any year.

 

I really hope that our committee can see their way to paying us pro rata, as I think I will loose 2 members of staff if that can not be done. These members of staff have been with us for over 5 years each and due to changes within their personal circumstances can no longer afford not being paid for 52 weeks of the year. I fully support them and would be devastated to loose them, their knowledge and love of the job that they do is irriplaceable.

 

Oh and by the way we had Ofsted in today!

 

Debbie

[Guest]

Oh and by the way we had Ofsted in today!

 

Can't wait to hear your good news Debbie.

 

Fingers crossed the committee agree to pro rata, maybe suggest they consider using a PAYE service, the one I used was very reasonable, cost me less than wha I saved in N.I contributions. All done over email too.

 

Your member of staff who need to be paid pro rata could actually save a little each week to see them through the holiday periods, yes a slight loss due to increased NI contributions, but could be done. Have these staff also got information regards working tax credits if they are struggling?

 

Peggy

[Guest]

Ofsted came in yesterday.

 

We were expecting them any time as it has been 3 years since our last inspection. I think it was probably delayed because we have moved premises twice this year and we are currently in a porta cabin on our local Primary School grounds.

 

However, picture the scene, there I sit chatting to my Chairperson as we open up for morning session and I see this woman walking towards me, I think ooh you've got a familiar face where do I know you from? Realization sets in as she says "Good morning, I am your Ofsted Inspector and I am here today to carry out your inspection" Whilst trying not to fall off my chair and fix a broad welcoming grin to my face I greet her warmly and proceed to carry on with registration. As I finish she says that it seems to be a shame to do our inspection today as when we move again in January she would have to come back and do it all again! As we have already seen her on 3 occasions this year to do suitability checks for myself, the chairperson and two buildings she was quite happy to delay it until January.

 

I then felt a little deflated as after getting over the initial shock I was quite confident that we could sail through our inspection and asked her if she could have a quick look about to see if there was anything we were doing that was obviously wrong. She said our building was looking fantastic (as she had previously seen a bare shell) it was warm and welcoming and the staff were all engaged with the children and they were all obviously happy to be here. Questioned her on the dreaded SEF and although I had not filled it out she was happy to see that I had downloaded the guidance and form and had made a few notes (taking it to spain with me later today). We wished her a good morning and she was on her way.

 

I have been on at my staff that they would be eligable for working tax credits Peggy, and think that I have finally got through to them and its something that they are going to persue this half term.

 

Off to Spain now. I hope every one has a great half term and look forward to reading more posts soon.

 

thanks Debbie

[Guest]

Because we only work 39 weeks of the year but are paid 43 with additional holiday pay, until recently we were paid pro rata over 52 weeks of the year. PSLA came in and said that this was against the law and we couldn't be paid this way anymore and had to be paid on our hourly basis. Having a couple of members of staff who rely on their wages heavily each week this past few months have been a nightmare for them as for the summer holiday period they had no money coming in.

 

However I have since found out that we could be paid 39 weeks pro rata of the year with holiday pay paid in full say 1 week xmas, 1 week easter and 2 weeks in summer.

 

Has anybody else had any dealings with this and how are you paid?

 

thanks

Debbie

 

I pay my staff weekly then a weeks holiday at Crimbo one at easter and 2 in the summer - if you are getting pain over the whole year how does it work out if someone is sick? This is my argument against it for them - cos their wages wouldn't be right would they?

[Inge]

Anyone off sick or off for any reason on days they would have worked..we deduct this from the wages for that month.. and the person who worked the shifts gets it in that months wage as overtime worked..

 

Or we find they often swap shifts so no one loses any money..

 

Inge

[Guest]

Yes I agree that it is tricky to work out if somebody has time off either sick or unpaid leave to go anywhere (I have missed today's work as I was travelling back from spain) and at the moment I have simply deducted todays wages from my pay. We are very lucky to be allowed 5 days paid sick pay and to date nobody abuses this and nobody actually takes that amount of days.

 

I will be proposing that we have a professional out fit such as the PSLA who provide a wage service, who can work out these things and implement them accordingly, of course this comes at a cost and we will have to look at all the pros and cons carefully.

 

PS Spain was beautiful, lazing on sun lounger reading my SEF and still haven't finished it.

 

Debbie

[Guest]

Your Ofsted Inspector sounds very nice, will it be the same person visiting you in January, do you know?

 

Lucky you Spain, glad to hear you had a nice break and that it seems you are gradually sorting out your PAYE queries.

 

Peggy

[Guest]

I sincerely hope that we have the same inspector in January, we have built up a really good relationship with her over these last few months with all the moves wev'e had.

 

Thanks Peggy Spain was really fab and relaxing (well it would have been if I hadn't had major problems with my teenage son and his antics, had been living with girlfriend and plonked his self back on our doorstep just before we went to Spain, pennyless in major debt and all other kinds of problems. Oh well each age and stage they go through provides different challenges!).

 

I could start a whole new thread!!

 

Debbie

[valp59]

Just thought I should mention that the minimum holiday entitlement is currently 5.6 weeks and not 4 weeks! It increased in October 2007 to 4.8 weeks and then again in April 2009 to 5.6 weeks so technically you are all receiving too little holiday pay and employers are contravening employment law. i only found out about this when I was checking for current regulations regarding pro-rata holiday pay. I almost wish I hadn't coz it's costing me a fortune! You can get info on www.direct.gov.uk

 

Regards

 

Valerie

[Inge]

As you say 5.6 is from NEXT April 2009... so still time...

 

Inge

[valp59]

Sorry yes Inge that should have read currently 4.8 weeks. I was getting all excited because it was my first post!! I know I am

trying to budget for the rise now as it is a big increase to the annual wage bill which dare I say it won't be reflected in increased funding levels but that's another story!!

 

Valerie

[Inge]

no apology needed.. I just wanted to reassure everyone that we had a few months to sort this out...

 

Pleased to see you have made your first post.........noting you have been a member for a while. welcome.. we are not a scary lot really....

 

And I agree constantly budgeting for these cost rises and not getting equivalent increase in income is always a headache.

 

Inge

[Guest]

Welcome Valerie

 

As you can see this entire subject is a huge can of worms; As I understand it you need to calculate how many hours a week is worked on average over the whole year. As the four weeks of holiday under the E U Working Time Directive are excluded from the average working week calculations, a year consists of 48 weeks (52 weeks in a year minus 4 weeks = 48 weeks)

 

An employee working 5 days a week is entitled to 24 working days (4.8 weeks) at present but as Inge correctly points out this will increase next April 09.

 

An employee who works less than 5 days is entitled to less holiday pay, for casual staff working irregular hours is even less so that if they only work for eg 6 hrs they are entitled to 1 hr holiday pay.

 

Whole thing is very confusing, that is why I am sugesting to our committee that we get in an outside professional to calculate this for us.

 

Still haven't managed a meeting with our chair as her little boy has been poorly, fingers crossed for next week

 

Debbie

[valp59]

Thanks for the welcome Inge/Debbie. As you have noticed I have been reading posts for a while and picked up loads of useful info but never got round to posting anything - you probably won't be able to stop me now!!

 

Not sure if it will help but on the business link website (www.businesslink.gov.uk) if you search using 'holiday pay' they have an interactive tool to work out how much to pay your employees. I haven't actually used it so I don't know how well it works for our variable hours/days etc but it might be worth a look?

 

Valerie

[Guest]

I have found this piece of information for calculating the holiday pay for term time, part time workers - well its what we have been using so far, so let me know if you see a problem with it, won't you?!

 

http://www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/employment.../faq/index.html

 

the relevant section is under question 4

[Guest]

Thanks Valerie and holly

 

very informative sites, I will pass these on to my committee

 

debbie

[HappyMaz]

Welcome to the Forum, Valerie: as Inge says - now that you've made your first posts, keep them coming. We're really quite friendly and hardly ever bite the newcomers!

 

Maz

[HappyMaz]

Here's a news item about a new report urging the Government to intervene in the whole issue of pay in early years. So I'm sure Bezza will be along soon to sort it. Was that a low flying pig I just saw!?

[Inge]

the last sentence says it all..

 

now where is that pig...

 

Inge

[Deb]

The last sentance does say it all. Surely it's short sighted though, spending all this money training us all, there has to be some remuneration for all the long hours of reflection we do! Otherwise this investment could be wasted if people give up during or after completing their study because they are disillusioned. It may not be the Government's responsibility to intervene in pay in our sector but surely it is their responsibility to set the level of nursery education funding at a level that employers can afford to pay a salary that is commensurate with experience and qualifications.

 

Over to you Bezza!

[Guest]

I noticed that today too and thought exactly the same about the last sentence

 

Not their place to intervene, well excuse me, as soon as NEG came into play they do just that, intervene but at a non sustainable level.

 

Peggy

[lynned55]

Honestly, what a big fat cop out!! How dare they, not their role to intervene, Well I can think of a few other areas where it certainly wasn't their role to intervene, but that hasn't/didn't stop them, Peggy you are so right as soon as NÉG came into force they do just that!!

Edited November 12, 2008 by lynned55

[Guest]

Well, we have finally had our meeting with our committee (chair and treasurer)to discuss a way forward with our wages.

 

We started with we would be extremely grateful if they could look into the way that we are paid and if there was anything that they could do to help us, especially with the summer holidays i.e. 6 weeks without any wage coming in.

 

To our delight and surprise they said that they had looked into it and they would be able to do this with the help of the wage service provided by the PSLA. We were over the moon. With the backing of the rest of the committee this will begin April 09 the beginning of our financial year, and in time for the next summer holiday period.

 

We thanked them, and came away extremely happy.

 

However watch this space, we remain optomistic!

 

Debbie

[Deb]

There is an article in the November/December issue of the PLA Under 5's Magazine about how to calculate holiday entitlement based on the guidance in the Berr website www.berr.gov.uk