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Having just read the thread under 'Ofsted' about the increase in registration charges, I just had to say that in Hampshire, we have always recieved free short training courses eg First Aid, health and safety etc etc as well as the usual foundation stage courses............however, having just got our training magazine, it now states that the Governement has cut the funding and that all settings will now have to pay an anual subscription (£400 for us) to recieve training!!!!!!!!!!! I'm sorry but I think its disgusting that not only do we loose a days pay for attending them but we now have to pay for them aswell!!!! The Government want highly qualified staff in early years but are not prepared to pay for them, either in the wages offered or the training costs!!!!!! :o My setting is presently full so will be able to absorb the cost (this year) but what about the smaller struggling settings?? this extra expense may tip them over the edge!!! xD

 

Has this happened in any other areas? Or have you always had to pay for training?

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depends on the training.. w have had to pay something towards the cost of some courses but not others... first aid and heatlth and safetty being just 2 of them, most FStage ones are free as are the cluster meetings, some like those for CLL we had free, with costs for cover staff so we were paid to attend them.

We are lucky in that our setting will pay you for attending , particularly those which mean you would be close without the training, eg first aid., but if we had to pay a set fee regardless of how much we access training we would then not be paid.

 

Some years we access several courses and others virtually none as staff are all fully up to date, seems a bit unfair to pay when you may only access one or two courses over the year, better to pay for any as you need them.

 

Inge

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In Windsor and Maidenhead we get free training (except long courses - although often a bursary is available which pays most of the cost - and first aid - which we have to fund ourselves) and I pay staff for any relevant, job specific training they attend. If this is on a working day I pay for the hours they are training rather than the session hours - so if it runs on into the afternoon they get paid overtime.

 

I haven't heard that there is to be any 'levy' for training in our area (although we do get charged £20 if we don't turn up to a training course). As an employer, I recognise the need for training and value the training our staff attend, and if I had to pay for our staff to be trained, £10 a week wouldn't seem so much - especially when I know how much some trainers charge for a day's work! However, it is somewhat galling as you say to have to lose a day's pay to attend and then have to meet the cost of the training as well. Surely your setting won't be passing on the cost to the employees?

 

It worries me that staff in some areas are not being paid to attend training - although I do appreciate groups are under such financial pressure that it is not always possible to pay for training time. If, in addition to this, staff are being paid minimum wages, then is there a possibility that groups are acting illegally in not paying for the hours spent training?

 

Its a minefield really...

 

Maz

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It truly is a minefield Maz! Our preschool pays for training during session hours, if it continues into the afternoon, evening or weekend we get time off instead (ie if your child is ill and we have used up our 6 day paid allowance). We have a very understanding committee! We are very lucky. But as you say if we are having to pay large sums for training now I am not sure it will continue!

 

Shiny

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In Bristol we are expected to do 4 days training each per year. However the costs vary from free to £100 / day. We have recently heard that the subsidy for 1st aid has been withdrawn and it will now cost £75. :o ! All the EYFS ones and SEN / Inclusion are free and we automatically get supply cover costs for these so that can offset some of the expensive ones.

 

Al

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Having just read the thread under 'Ofsted' about the increase in registration charges, I just had to say that in Hampshire, we have always recieved free short training courses eg First Aid, health and safety etc etc as well as the usual foundation stage courses............however, having just got our training magazine, it now states that the Governement has cut the funding and that all settings will now have to pay an anual subscription (£400 for us) to recieve training!!!!!!!!!!! I'm sorry but I think its disgusting that not only do we loose a days pay for attending them but we now have to pay for them aswell!!!! The Government want highly qualified staff in early years but are not prepared to pay for them, either in the wages offered or the training costs!!!!!! :o My setting is presently full so will be able to absorb the cost (this year) but what about the smaller struggling settings?? this extra expense may tip them over the edge!!! xD

 

Has this happened in any other areas? Or have you always had to pay for training?

As a manager of a setting I pay for 4 sessions of training per staff (12 for the Senco, 6 for all others as it is a mandatory requirement for the setting for them to attend training, including first aid) In Wiltshire we get 50 per cent subsidy for First Aid, Health & Safety, Child Protection etc., and LEA training are free unless we do not attend - then a £15/£30 fine is applied if there is none attendance or we did not cancal training within the given time. Haven't been advised yet for annual subscription. Also have it in contract that if an employee leaves within a given time then a percentage of the cost of the training will be paid back.

 

Kim

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we pay £5 per person per course and theres a £45 cancellation fee if we dont turn up

eyfs and sen training are free and we can claim funds towards cover for supply staff so that members of staff can still be paid for training days.

 

but £400 would cripple us we just couldnt pay anything like that

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Hi Jenni

 

I'm from Hampshire too and have just had to pay £400.

 

Isn't it strange that the initial letter about the training subscription sounded as if we were better off than many counties, but considering the responses so far it doesn't seem that way!!

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We're in neighbouring Dorset, and we do not have to pay the £400. That's appalling.

 

We get paid for mandatory courses such as first aid. There is also a bursary for SEN courses.

 

Other courses are now free although we will soon have to pay £20 if we don't turn up. Dorset will have to improve their communication first though so that we know if we are actually on a course or not!

 

We attend all other courses in our own time. If the course is on a working day, staff can take a day off in lieu.

 

It is a bit galling though when somebody gets paid for attending an SEN course yet others don't for other courses. The government should be paying for us all to attend as well as paying for the courses.

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In Stockport we pay a subsidised fee for first aid training but all other training is free at present.

My concern is that this is going to apply countrywide from what Jenni has said. Is this coming into force in the new financial year Jenni? If so it could be that the rest of us just haven't been told about this yet. I hate to be all doom and gloom but Jenni has said that the government has cut the funding. Is this just to your area or will it be for all LA's?

Linda

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I've also had to pay £795 for the degree, could only get funding for 75%. it is very annoying as they want trained staff but wont pay for training. My setting will get £500 back which really irritates me as i have had to pay for the books etc... and lost a days pay every week but they get the £500, it goes to the setting not the person doing it..

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we have to pay for training, we have to attend 4 a year - and they are between £15 - £35 each.

I really think that if practitioners have to pay for their own training then it should at least be tax deductible. Mind you that's not very helpful if you don't actually earn enough to pay tax. And of course, for many workers £35 is more than they earn in a day anyway - and if they have to lose a day's pay to attend then that really adds insult to injury.

 

What a sorry mess.

 

Maz

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The subscription has to be paid by April 2008!! If practitioners have already booked courses for May, June July (like we have) and they havent paid the subscription, then they will be charged £40 for half a day and £80 for a full day!! the course I have booked is for 3 days!!!! aahhhhh

 

This is an extract:

 

'we are commited to offering the very best training opportunities for Hampshire practitioners and are currently looking at our programme for 2008-2011. During these three years we will see a significant reduction in funding, which will have a big impact on our budgets. The Transformation Fund Ceases on the 31st March 08 and is being replaced by the 'Graduate Leader Fund'. ' This is a smaller pot of money'

 

So they are blaming the reduction in funding on central funding! So it may happen in other areas! The subscription fees are based on the number of places offered, so we pay £400 because we have 60 plus children. The sub fees are less if you have less places.

 

Our Treasurer is less than pleased at this sudden unexpected expense!!

 

jx

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I've also had to pay £795 for the degree, could only get funding for 75%. it is very annoying as they want trained staff but wont pay for training. My setting will get £500 back which really irritates me as i have had to pay for the books etc... and lost a days pay every week but they get the £500, it goes to the setting not the person doing it..

 

when we had a student doing a degree to claim the 500 we has to say what it would be used for, so it was expected that the student would benefit - we used it for supply cover and some books which she bought and used but then became the property of the setting for others to use.

 

Inge

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when we had a student doing a degree to claim the 500 we has to say what it would be used for, so it was expected that the student would benefit - we used it for supply cover and some books which she bought and used but then became the property of the setting for others to use.

 

Inge

In any case, I wouldn't think £500 would go very far!

 

Maz

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I've also had to pay £795 for the degree, could only get funding for 75%. it is very annoying as they want trained staff but wont pay for training. My setting will get £500 back which really irritates me as i have had to pay for the books etc... and lost a days pay every week but they get the £500, it goes to the setting not the person doing it..

 

 

If your setting required you to do the degree then they must pay for your time attending it as it is 'working' hours relevant to your job.

 

Peggy

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my point exactly peggy, according to the college the £500 is to cover the cost of someone doing my hours, but i'm not getting paid for it, so they are not paying out any extra. so as i see it i should be getting paid for my day at college.... but my committee don't see it like that...

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my point exactly peggy, according to the college the £500 is to cover the cost of someone doing my hours, but i'm not getting paid for it, so they are not paying out any extra. so as i see it i should be getting paid for my day at college.... but my committee don't see it like that...

 

 

If you really feel strongly about this simcity and the committee have said you have to do the training get some advice from PLA (if you are a member- law call) or CAB. I have searched for quite a while using google to see if I can find out the law on employees rights to pay whilst attending training to no avail :o

 

Peggy

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However, I did find this leagal advice site which states how employers can retrieve training costs from employees should the employee leave soon after completion of training, indicating that pay for training is common practice ( but doesn't indicate whether it is or not a legal requirement to pay)

 

training costs recovery

 

Peggy

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Sorry, thinking on my feet here, It would be useful maybe if you could ask your committee to review ( or write, if you haven't got one) a Training policy, especially in light of recent other posts about the reduction of funded training available, and LA asking for annual training fee.

 

Peggy

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SimCity, could you contact the people (SureStart?) who organise the transformation fund and get them to contact your employers (the committee) to inform them that that money is to pay to cover you whilst you undertake this training, that is why they were given this money. SureStart will surely want to know if this money has not been used for the purposes for which it was intended.

 

Good luck

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Ours came from the university , had to claim it from them, as I said to get it we had to say where it would be spent, but a no one checked it afterwards suppose it could have been used anywhere!!.

 

Inge

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However, I did find this leagal advice site which states how employers can retrieve training costs from employees should the employee leave soon after completion of training, indicating that pay for training is common practice ( but doesn't indicate whether it is or not a legal requirement to pay)Peggy

I'm fairly certain that whilst it is considered 'best practice' to pay staff for training they attend, there is no hard and fast rule. I agree that if an employer requries a person to attend training then they should pay them for doing so. And to keep the money intended for staff cover when no such cover is needed is an insult, frankly.

 

An employer who behaved in this way should not be surprised if the newly qualified person promptly found another job and left! And then there would be no training costs to retrieve, either :o

 

Maz

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