When Do You Get Your Grant Increase?

[Guest]

Hi all,

In Kent we are not getting our grant increase until September. We currently receive £ 7.98 per child per session.

 

Are there any settings out there who are getting an increase in April? Do you mind me asking how much you receive?

 

Thanks

 

Peggy

[Guest]

As far as i know, according to our treasurer, we get £8.00 per 2.5 hour session, and that is being increased from 33 weeks per year to 38 from April.

 

Caroline

[Guest]

Are there any settings out there who are getting an increase in April? Do you mind me asking how much you receive?

 

Bristol increases from 33 to 38 weeks per year in April. I think its £7.85

[Guest]

Stockport settings are getting the weeks increased and the amount per session too in April but I don't know how much to.

Have they said why they are keeping it back until September?

Linda

[Inge]

Hi Peggy,

 

we get our increase in April to 8.0850526 Per session....

 

Yes you read right, just found the paperwork to check and this is what it says....

 

this will be to cover 190 sessions per year. (38 weeks)

 

but we do not have to offer 38 weeks, we just tell them how many weeks we will be open for.

 

 

Inge

[Guest]

Stockport settings are getting the weeks increased and the amount per session too in April but I don't know how much to.

Have they said why they are keeping it back until September?

Linda

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They have implied that it is because of the delay in the publication of the new code of practice has caused their delay in "working out the funding levels". Though they have not said this in so many words. So, no, not any real explanation as yet.

 

WOW, Inge for me that would be a 2.08 pence increase per child per session. I wish minimum wage would only go up that much each year, then I could possibly balance my books

 

Peggy

[Guest JPH]

We will be receiving £8.23 per session as from April, for up to 38 weeks. (Devon).

[Guest]

I have had a letter today to inform us of the new grant funding. Ours has risen from £7.77 to £8.08-better than a poke in the eye I suppose. I think we have been one of the lowest paying authorities for some time and I know they top slice it to pay for the teacher advisors. This will be paid as from April. So why Kent is waiting until September goodness only knows. It can't be because of the delay in the new code of practice arriving as other authorities are paying it from April.

Linda

[Guest]

I have had a letter today to inform us of the new grant funding. Ours has risen from £7.77 to £8.08-better than a poke in the eye I suppose. I think we have been one of the lowest paying authorities for some time and I know they top slice it to pay for the teacher advisors. This will be paid as from April. So why Kent is waiting until September goodness only knows. It can't be because of the delay in the new code of practice arriving as other authorities are paying it from April.

Linda

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Thanks Linda, Your final sentence was exactly my thoughts that's why I thought I would ask everyone when theirs starts, I shall now be able to ask "Kent" why other LA's can sort it yet they can't.

 

Peggy

[hali]

errrr no Linda we are from £7.77 to £7.93!!! and we are in the royal bourough!!!!! do get it from April though

[Verona]

From April we are getting £8.13 per session for 38 weeks a year. They do not pay for part weeks that we are open though.

 

Sue J

[Deb]

Hi Peggy

 

In Dorset we are getting £8.20 per child/per session from April. You would think that Kent would have to increase the NEG if the Government has?

 

Deb

[Guest]

Hi Peggy

 

In Dorset we are getting £8.20 per child/per session from April.  You would think that Kent would have to increase the NEG if the Government has?

 

Deb

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They are going to increase it but not until September as far as I am aware

It seems your grant is the highest so far

 

Peggy

[Guest]

oops apart from JPH who pips you by 3p

 

Peggy

 

thanks everyone for your replies, keep them coming, it is proving quite interesting how a "national" grant is allocated differently in each area. postcode lottery ring a bell?

[sharonash]

Can anyone tell me how they deduct the funding from the parents fees, we take the funded amount of £7.92 off of whatever the session costs for a period of 11 weeks and then parents pay full fees until the next term/funding starts again. The reason I am asking is ofsted questioned it today and ased why I dont spread it across the year?

[Guest]

from april we go from £7.56 to £7.93 in norfolk,

 

why is it so differnt from area to area, im sure we all offer the same service and have the same costs?

[nicki-k]

Hi Sharonash,

 

Are your sessions 2 1/2 hours?

 

We have always charged a top-up fee if a child has done more than 55 sessions per term. ( more than 11 weeks) We then divide the difference into two amounts and the parents pay half at the beginning of each half-term e.g. beginning of Sept and November. Does this make sense?

 

We will no longer have to do this from April when we will get funding for 38 weeks per year unless a child attends for more than 5 sessions per week.

 

I thought that if your session lasted for 2 1/2 hours you could not charge any amount over the government funding for that session. Maybe thats a Kent ruling .

 

What do you think Peggy?

Edited March 20, 2006 by nicki-k

[Guest]

You are right Nicki-you can only charge fees if you are over the 2 1/2 hours and more than eleven weeks per term.

And Ruthie I know that Stockport take a certain amount to pay for our teacher advisors. Each authority can basically do what they like with the nursery funding, and obviously some areas are more generous than others. I had thought that Stockport was one of the worst areas, but that no longer seems to be the case.

Linda

[Guest]

Can anyone tell me how they deduct the funding from the parents fees, we take the funded amount of £7.92 off of whatever the session costs for a period of 11 weeks and then parents pay full fees until the next term/funding starts again. The reason I am asking is ofsted questioned it today and ased why I dont spread it across the year?

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I would say the answer to the question is that we are not funded on an annual basis but on a termly basis and therefore costs differ each term.

 

It would also depend on your terms and conditions, we require a half terms notice if a child is leaving. I would love to ask for a years notice but I don't think that would wash with parents

 

I think schools budgets are paid annually, but not sure, maybe this is where the Inspector is getting confused.

 

Peggy

[Guest]

Hiya everyone,

Mine comes into being in April and will be £8.?? Cannot remember what it was either 13 or 30p - I have a feeling it is 30p - I will check when I go into work tomorrow. There will be no rise in September but it comes in from April. Having read the Code of Practice - am I right in thinking that we are are to offer 38 weeks from April 2006, if so then we need to address this in the Summer term - for those of us who are currently running a little under that this is where we can gain a week. However, if I am right n thinking about the 38 weeks start now, then surely the funding should as well, seems like they are short changing you. WE can offer part weeks at beginning and end of term as long as they add up to 5 days they will count as a week - if that make sense.

Peggy are you getting 38 weeks funding but no increase? Cannot remember what it is - mind you they can really choose what they like to do so as you say a post code lottery?

Nikki

[Guest]

Hi Sharonash,

 

Are your sessions 2 1/2 hours?

 

We have always charged a top-up fee if a child has done more than 55 sessions per term. ( more than 11 weeks) We then divide the difference into two amounts and the parents pay half at the beginning of each half-term e.g. beginning of Sept and November. Does this make sense?

 

We will no longer have to do this from April when we will get funding for 38 weeks per year unless a child attends for more than 5 sessions per week.

 

I thought that if your session lasted for 2 1/2 hours you could not charge any amount over the government funding for that session. Maybe thats a Kent ruling .

 

What do you think Peggy?

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That's right, you are not able to charge any extra for the "funded" element of your session. for example if your fees are £10 per 2.5 hr session and your grant is only £7.50 per 2.5 hr session, you cannot charge the parents the £2.50 difference.

 

On my invoices I show for a child attending 5 x 3hr sessions and 5 x lunch sessions per week for a 12 wk term.

 

total number of sessions attending eg: = 60

total number of funded sessions = 55

total number of sessions for parent to pay = ( 60-55) =5 @ £7.50 = £37.50

 

we open for 3 hrs so then I add

total unfunded 1/2 hrs = 55 x £1.25 ( £7.50/ by 6) = to pay £68.75

lunch @ £2.50 = 60 x £2.50 = £150

 

total due = (£37.50 + £68.75 + £150) - £256.25

 

This looks complicated here, but basically I don't show a figure for the funded sessions, I deduct these from the total attended each term, then show the charge for the remaining sessions, plus any time over the 2.5 hrs.

 

My fees are currently lower than the grant but I must not use this difference to offset the cost of what is described as the "care" time ( non - educational funding period)- this is classed as inappropriatte use of public money and is illegal.

 

The calculations are done on an excell invoice, so I don't have to do all the sums, just one figure and the sheet calculates the rest automatically.

 

Hope that doesn't confuse ( maths not being my strongest point)

 

Peggy

[Deb]

Yes, the Government wants us to offer 38 weeks from April, however, in our area (Dorset) we have until April 2007 to do this. Settings will be paid pro-rata for when they are open. We currently offer 38 weeks so it will not affect us and we will stay within 38 weeks.

 

Peggy's invoice seems very logical and straightforward. We invoice per half-term.

 

As mentioned previously, I understand we can charge for extra services we provide over and above the 2 1/2 hours funding, however, we cannot charge funded children more than non funded children. As we charge non funded chidren £7.00 for 2 3/4 hours (equating to 64p per 1/4 hour) we can charge funded children 64 p for the extra 1/4 hour we are open, this will give us an extra income of around £600 for the summer term alone. Have today had this confirmed by local Surestart Business Support Manager. We can also charge for lunch club, snacks etc. provided we treat funded and non-funded children the same.

 

Deb

[Guest]

Hi Peggy - cannot believe the differences in NEG's - reading through the replies we seem to be doing OK in Cheshire - Grant increase in April 2006 from 33 to 38 weeks from £8.22 to £8.41. Until reading this I thought we were all on the same amount . . . .

[hali]

does anyone know if you can charge for extras like extra member of staff for our accreditation and craft materials etc????

 

Our committe do this under what they call 'sundries' £11.00 per half term..is this allowed???

[Inge]

we are not allowed to charge for ANYTHING.

 

All funded sessions are to be just that...we have been told this several times and are reminded every time we claim funding.......

 

As to all areas having the same rules.....who knows!!!

 

 

Inge

[Deb]

Any charges for extra services provided would have to be transparent for all to see. One other thing, we have to ensure parents know that these extra services are optional, ie they could collect their child at 11.30 am if they wish.

 

Deb

[Guest]

I am surprised that you are not allowed to charge for anything Inge. This seems very unfair if LEA nurseries are allowed to charge for trips etc. Our local nurseries ask for a voluntary contribution for things like outings, as do the schools, and they also ask for £1 a week for school fund which pays for things like baking materials etc.

Linda

[Inge]

yep, not allowed to charge for anything extra......ask for a donation...we tried that only 2 parents willing to donate...and all children expecting a trip........ but these days I am very reluctant to take any child out without cleared staff or own parent to support all children....

 

 

At present trips are non funded days and family days out...but for how much longer i am not sure!!!

 

 

other items all have to come from funding....but we do ask for donations whenever possible....current one is for soil or compost to fill our new raised flower / vegetable bed!!

 

Inge

[Guest]

We are in Poole myself and Janice, which is in the County of Dorset but because Poole is its own Borough the same as Bournemouth, we all get different. You're doing well Deb, cos we are only getting £8.05 from April, but we are going to the 38 weeks. Is the county thats not doing it til september (sorry lost the thread of which counties its was) doing it then because its the beginning of the school year and not financial year. Surely the Authority is getting its funding from the April as that is the beginning of their financial year. What a lovely lot of interest the bank will pay if all that money sits in their bank account from April until september when they start giving it out.

Also why are they top slicing for the Advisory teachers, I was to understand that advisory teachers were paid out of a different fund. you can check that with the Dfes direct in London. Ask for the Early Years dept. They are very good at letting you know what funding Authorities are allowed to get, i think its for public knowledge. We had problems in Poole a few years ago and a few of us checked with the Dfes directly and the LEA had to pay us back a refund. Some times its worth checking.!!!

[Guest]

does anyone know if you can charge for extras like extra member of staff for our accreditation and craft materials etc????

 

Our committe do this under what they call 'sundries'  £11.00 per half term..is this allowed???

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I agree with Debs that extra charges should be transparent, and with Inge that no extra's should be charged for the "Curriculum" offered during a funded period.

 

An extra member of staff for Accreditation does not directly affect the curriculum offered, but I would think that it would be good practice to inform parents that £x amount is charged for this in addition to their fees ( at the point of entry ie: under your terms and conditions agreement with parents before they register)

The cost of craft materials, I feel should be budgeted within the whole fees structure and not added as an additional extra, this is for unfunded children, the cost of craft materials for funded children should come from the funding.

Hope that makes sense. this is just my interpretation of what funded money is for etc, maybe follow Stephs advice and contact DFES.

 

I , like Inge also ask for voluntary donations from soil , snack foods etc.

 

Peggy