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im wondering if anybody can help clarify something. i am a new manager and deploy my staff with the correct ratios . i have heard recently that now ofsted go by how many staff there is in the building rather that per room. so does this mean that for example it would be ok for the toddler age room to have 9 children with 2 members of staff because i am super numery.

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My understanding of this mean more that it allows 'flexibilty' within the setting as to what is hapening at a given time........ so if you have some children sleeping etc.

Not sure if would count if you had 9 under 2s with all 'up and about' and freeflow in/out going on though. (this is only an example :1b - not saying /implying you do this :D )



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Could you please link me or show me how you know about this new Ofsted regulation of "how many staff in the building" because i would love to keep up with this kind of information from now on :)



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I agree with looby loo on this, which is why I think very carefully before I agree to take 1 over numbers, 9 with a 1:4 ratio isnt very effective for us, although we do have three members of staff that are fully qualified and supernumery in anyway. I also bear in mind that when a carer is doing handover they are not counted in ratio, so you would effectively be 1:9 at welcome and close of day whenever a parent came, also for toileting etc you could end up very overnumbers esp if its a messy toilet incident that could take some time to sort out.


In emergencies I can see how staff need to be stretched, however if a setting plans /rotas to be just out of numbers this is not a good idea or practice and I'm sure that Ofsted would not be impressed.

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My administrator and I have been having a nightmare with this, this week. We had set our registers and since Easter we have had established parents wanting to change sessions and new starters arriving saying they want different/extra sessions too! They don't seem to understand that we have to stick to a ratio!! We are a pre-school with two rooms and take from 2y9m so have some in at 1:4 and some as 1:8 and it takes literally hours to work out how many staff we have available/need for the amount of children across the two rooms and then how many spaces are available. There is some rule about adults on the premises - I think it is also to cover lunch breaks for staff. We have occasionally used that if staff have been ill or on courses and we haven't been able to get cover. It's not ideal though as the staff on lunch are effectively on call.

Does anyone else have this issue too - in September when lots have moved on to school - less staff are required. So far it's been OK as the staff we have are mostly OK with having less hours but we expanded last year and are now up to 7 virtually full time staff having just taken on an other (mostly to accommodate the amount of under 3s). Come September though we will only need the equivalent of 4 full time to start with until they pick up sessions (they tend to start on 2 or 3 a week) or more start. In the past we have taken people on temporarily for a term or so but this seems silly to do every year...

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unfortunately this is now the nature of the game since the one school intake came into play! its all very well having statutory guidlines such as ratios ( with little flexibility) and qualified staff regulations when most preschools are full to burst in summer and then completely depeleted in Autumn!! Its frustrating beyond belief. I have continued to employ staff even when. they havent been needed to maintain continuity and preserve a good team and to ensure we have staff that are dependable when the summer rush comes, but not any more I'm afraid....my bank manager is chomping at the bit for the overdraft to be repaid eeek! under twos cost to a business such as mine is huge...yet cant survive without them!!, I hope one day the government REALLY appreciate our worth and start funding the twos, especially now we have another initiative.....the two year check! ho hum....

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