Labour's plans for 3000+ nurseries in primary schools

[Helen]

I've been mulling this over....a lot! I have very mixed feelings- this is what the Guardian said:

Under Labour’s plan, 3,334 classrooms in existing primary schools will be converted to accommodate 100,000 extra childcare places. Spare capacity is growing in primaries due to falling birth rates. The Department for Education estimates that about 85,000 places are needed for current plans.

Labour said that refurbishing classrooms, which they hope will start within weeks of entering government and be complete well before the end of a first term, would cost an average £40,000 each. The total, £140m, would be funded by the party’s plans to levy VAT on private school fees.

It seems to me that refurbishing classrooms to be suitable for babies and our youngest children, needs very careful thought. The classroom selected needs to be easily accessible- lots of buggies going in and out, for example, and there needs to be places for parents to speak privately to staff. Nappy changing and rest/sleep areas can't just be shoved into a corner- so we're not talking about one classroom needing to be adapted, but several areas. Having just had work done on my house, £40,000 doesn't go a very long way!

On the other hand, if nursery staff were paid better than in the PVI sector, had better conditions (sick leave, pensions, etc), guaranteed CPD and career progression opportunities, and more chance of working in a high quality maintained nursery, I can see the attraction. But if the already drained PVI sector loses any more staff, it will be disastrous. Where are all these members of staff coming from?

What do you think?

[finleysmaid]

I understand that some schools especially in the north of england have nursery provision (from 2 years i believe) but this plan is to alleviate the issues in the south of England and especially london boroughs. The government needs to rethink the way early years is funded and how that funding is arranged. That is clear. As a charity our parents pay £30 per week for a 32.5 hour week . We get rates relief which makes it possible to run and rent relief from our landlord because of the way we deal with the building etc. However some of our families earn over £100k a year ...i don't think they should get free childcare . 

Putting childcare in to schools could work if it was carefully planned but this is not careful planning . 40k will not be enough to build put in proper toileting facilities etc etc a franchise costs 40k minimum ! 

How are they going to train headteachers to do this? they are NOT specialists in Early years many will feel they need to do a top down model and try to educate in a developmentally inappropriate way. Are the teacher training courses going to include more about development in them? how are play areas going to be suitable for little ones, how are they going to sleep etc ????(as you say) schools are already stretched and will need to open for 52 weeks to cover this plan...have they thought about this????????

 

[SueFinanceManager]

On 26/06/2024 at 10:47, finleysmaid said:

schools are already stretched and will need to open for 52 weeks to cover this plan...have they thought about this????????

I hadn't thought about that issue as in a school based nursery might effectively replace/put out of business a local PVI setting but one is full day care and the other term time only.  Working families cannot be limited to term time only settings.....trying to cover the holidays especially of you are a single parent is almost impossible.
Another issue to overcome.
I do, on the other hand think what Helen said above about maybe nursery staff could benefit from better pay and conditions would be a great thing for the workforce.

[finleysmaid]

On 26/06/2024 at 16:15, SueFinanceManager said:

I do, on the other hand think what Helen said above about maybe nursery staff could benefit from better pay and conditions would be a great thing for the workforce.

we pay our staff for 52 weeks a year not pro rata like schools mostly do. We do however work longer hours than most schools in fact over the year we do around 180 more hours per year. My staff therefore come out with a decent wage , plus pension plus flexible arrangements, uniform and car parking !!! If they worked for 52 weeks of course you need more staff to cover holidays. good luck to the headteachers who can make this work!

[Froglet]

You are all far more experienced in this than me but whilst I can see that the need is absolutely there it feels like a plan that needs more input.

Schools are already stretched and I agree that creating a suitable space isn’t as straightforward as it sounds. It’s also about creating a set up that can work longer term. Staffing appropriately os a huge issue - making the hours and ratios work with the staff available and managing it if anyone is off sick.

 I can see an incentive in that I think schools would hope that a nursery would grow their intake as many children automatically go into the reception class but there is so much more to it.

[Helen]

Aside from the actual premises themselves, I think the first thing that needs to happen is for the new government to do all they can to ensure early years is seen as a professional pathway with good career progression, CPD and to demonstrate respect for the jobs that educators do. We need to attract the very best to our early years courses, and to ensure newly qualified staff have ongoing development opportunities. There has to be a much better understanding around how important the first 5 years are.

And I agree, finleysmaid,  families with an income of over £100,000 shouldn't receive free childcare- that money would be much better allocated elsewhere.