Guest Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 We are a committee run pre-school. I just wondered how much imput your committee have in the everyday running of the pre-school. Especially with the staff, mine seem to be disciplining staff and monitoring them, for example i spoke to a member of staff about her record keeping, committee have now taken to checking her record keeping every week to check she is doing it, i do feel they are going over my head or am i just being too emotional. They have also asked staff to come to them with any problems etc. I just wondered how much involvement your committe have and where you draw the line.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Every setting is different simcity. As a structure the committee are the 'employers' of you and your staff, however that said, they have employed you for a purpose, if your contract includes 'supervising staff' then that is your role. Basically it seems there is a lack of communication and understanding of roles here. Why not ask for a meeting and have a chat about your feelings, about agreeing and clarifying roles and nip this in the bud before things become out of perspective. Just an added note, some committees have very little involvement so in a sense value that yours are interested in being involved. Negotiation of a 'shared' approach to staffing etc, between yourself and your committee, all working to the same goals will benefit all. You are not being too emotional you are just confused by unclear expectations of you and your role from your employers. I would say it is the committee role to be available for all staff to come to them, but again it needs to be made clear to all on what issues, how they will keep you informed or not of any issues staff may bring to them and how best you can work together for the benefit of the group. Peggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiny Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Our committee are very good. We have a written 'pecking order' for want of a better name. The supervisor is line manager to all staff and we are answerable to her, she in turn is then answerable to the committee and they are her line manager. None of our committee have childcare/education experience so they are happy for the day to day running being done by those of us who have. They agree our job descriptions and it is up to the supervisor to ensure we are carrying out what we should do. This is my only experience in committee run preschool. I've been here 8 years and it has always been that way. I am also a school governor and it works the same there. Staff to Head, Head to Govs. Do your committee have any experience/qualifications in educare at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Thanks for your reply. Non of my committee have any childcare experience. I have been in Committee run pre-schools for 18years and i never had a committee like this, usually they leave the day to day running to me and then i speak to them about any concerns the staff or i have. This has worked well in the past but this year since our AGM in september its just getting worse, they want to deal with all issues, down to monitoring all staff performances, having private one to one meetings (Chair and staff member) every 6/7 weeks, checking their record keeping/paperwork etc....... i have spoken to them about roles and responsibilities etc... but to no avail.... I have even had my development worker come in and speak to them, she agreed that day to day running and staff sgould be my responsibility then i report to them but it still isn't happening beginning to think i'm being over sensitive maybe i should just stick it out to next AGM and see what happens.... Thats why i wondered what happens in other pre-schools... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hali Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 does sound a litle OTT dosnt it, we are the same as shiny and always have been, committee usually only get invovled if i shout help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 (edited) I wonder if they have been contacted by a PLA worker who has given them information on what they should be doing... our committee had such a visit and were told they should do lots of things usually left to the manager, and it was only because of our close relationship that we knew about it. In our area most of the PLA stuff has been incorporated into the early years department of LEA, but they still employ 1 worker with the PLA (who is not linked to the early years dept.) who visited all settings, and she had been very persistent in doing so, as committee have been in place a while and were happy so did not feel any need to have a meeting, she did not want to meet staff just the committee! In our case the committee were able to say that everything was done by the manager, but some could take it as a need to become more involved in the setting, even without much knowledge of childcare, standards etc other than what they read or are told..... Lucky our committee also do as shiny , and work on a clear line manager structure everyone knowing who to go to first and only if further or unresolved problems to follow up with someone else. Inge Edited March 8, 2008 by Inge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiny Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Simcity, I can understand you must feel a bit upset by all this I would be exactly the same. You say you might ride it out to the next AGM? My only concern is will the new committee feel they too should continue with this OTT attitude, and who informs your committee what their roles and responsibilities are? Would it not be the present committee? If so will they not tell them to do this? I hope this is resolved soon and perhaps you could introduce a line management policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Do other settings have a line management policy? Does anyone have an example i could have a quick look at.... This could be something i could try and put in place.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiny Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 We don't have a policy, will outline what is in ours on Monday when I get it from work, is that ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 That would be great, Thanks shiny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 I think i will need to try and put some sort of line management in place. As chair has told me she wants to stand for another year.... I need some sort of clarifiction ... I can't last another whole year in this situation... that takes me to sept 09... Thanks for all your words of wisdom.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Lots of sympathy for you simcity, I have been in a similar position and couldn't stand it so had to leave the position ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Thanks Shirel, It's hard as you are stuck between the children who you build that relationship with and the committee. When i started here the pre-school had a bad ofsted, no policies or procedures.. so i have put it all in place and we have received good for our ofsted... feel like i'm being torn in two!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 That is exaclty how I felt, and still am a little torn about leaving as I set up a whole new system and op plan, Ofsted came we got Outstanding and I left! I felt I had done everything I could for the pre-school but couldn't cope with the intrusion into my life anymore, the phone calls, emails, letters and consistent obsession with every detail of pre-school from the committee members, some more than others. it is three months down the line now and i am still keeping in touch, a new leader has been appointed and i worry for her as I have maintained a healthy contact with some committee members and staff and things are already becoming difficult again, so I hear, in a way it is reassuring to see it wasn't just my over-sensitivity, but I am just hoping that the new leader is made of tuff stuff and can cope with it all. I am back where I started at a nursery where all my children went - deputy supervisor, less responsibility and concentrating on the degree and my family - sometimes you have to put yourself first and prioritise. Good luck - keep talking the forum helped me through all of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 I started to write a reply to you the other day and never finished as a friend dropped in unexpectedly for coffee! You really have my sympathies too, an overly controlling committee is a nightmare for us and they can be really difficult to work with. Think long and hard about your situation, but if you are unhappy then you have to act in some way. You may need to walk away from it like shirel, or you may just want to talk to the committee about how their actions are making you feel and tell them if things don't improve then you will leave. Either way, this then puts you back in control - don't let others dictate your life to you and make you really unhappy! Good luck, we're all here for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiny Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 I haven't forgotten about you simcity! I haven't been in to work yet but will go later today!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiny Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Have found the document. It was in the operational plan. It is entitled ROLES AND RESPONSIBILITIES AT PRESCHOOL. It outlines the roles and responsibilities of Chair person Treasurer Secretary Other committee members Supervisor Deputy Senior assistant Assistant SENCO Planning Co-ordinator Named person for child protection Named person for behaviour Health and safety coordinator First aid coordinator Equal opportunities co-ordinator It also splits the policies and procedures up so they are reviewed at certain times of the year. It states that these are to be reviewed by staff and committee together. When PSDP is reviewed and who and when reviews the SEF. There is info on internal complaints and procedures to take, responsibilities of evaluating practice and how often observations of practice are carried out on staff members and by who. It also states that day to day running is up to the supervisor and committee have a written supervisors report every term. It seems quite long winded, but at least it is down in black and white how does what then there is some accountability at the end of the day. Everyone is clear about who does what and it is reviewed every term to ensure everything is being done. Sorry to ramble. Hope it helps a little. Need a lay down now!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Thankyou sooo much shiny... you have given me alot to think about......Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Just to add to the list we also have Communications Language and Literacy co coordinator..(our LEA asks for one) Inge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiny Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Just to add to the list we also have Communications Language and Literacy co coordinator..(our LEA asks for one) Inge May be obvious to the average brain (under average brain talking) what is their role, I may want to introduce one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inge Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 The LEA provide training for this each year.. so far more than half the staff have attended, they have provided us with the resources as well, Lola, beat baby with books, Foundations Of literacy book, raps, story CDs and ideas to use. Coordinator ensures everyone is confident on using them and encourages us to do so , reviews use of things like the book corner, and changes it if needed to encourage children to use it. Lots has been revamped and changed .. gives a new perspective on things you do daily. Inge looks like another hi jacked thread.. sorry... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 I think I'm in the same boat. Maybe we secretly have the same committee? As I am having my own nightmarish clash with a committee who seem to be trying to take over everything. Feeling rubbish about the whole thing, I am sure they think I'm incompetent, members of staff are feeling inadequate and surplus to requirements and all the staff want to leave. AAAARRRGGGHHHHH!! I am encouraged by reading your posts though that there may be a glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel. An agreement of roles and responsibilites is the best way forward. Our committee have been in all week announcing this and that making changes and basically riding roughshod over everything we work bloody hard to acheive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2008 Share Posted April 28, 2008 I wish you luck emma. I have perservered and things are a little better. We now have a committee who seem to be listening and understand there roles... i have built up a reasonable relationship with the chair and dare i say staff seem a little happier, we still have the odd member of staff who seems to stir up the others. but it has taken alot of perserverance to get this far.... sometimes i felt like just chucking the whole thing in as it was so stressful and i was getting so fed up stuck between staff and committee. i kept asking myself was it worth it but then i would see the faces of the children and remember why i do this job and i stuck it out.. good luck - hope it all works out for you, let me know how it goes.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 29, 2008 Share Posted April 29, 2008 Thanks for that. I have a meeting planned for next week with our PLA advisor, early years advisor and chair to try and air our differences, get to the bottom of things and create and action plan for the future. So there is some hope but I do feel it will be extremely hard to work in harmony ever after, I live in hope though! Today went badly but tommorrow is another day. As you said it's the relationships with the children and the parents that keep you going. I too feel like giving up, packing it all in and going to work at TESCO!! where i can just go to work and come home again and not have to deal with all the hassle. But we have worked extremely hard to create a succesful preschool with a lovely warm friendly atmosphere and I am not going to let them ruin it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 I think in all these types of situations it is the need to all work towards a balance of understanding and valueing each others roles and valuing what each other does FOR THE GOOD OF THE SETTING / CHILDREN / PARENTS / STAFF. Easy to say I know, but maybe a good phrase to start any meeting from. Feelings of being undervalued, both staff and committee need to be turned around through 'professional dialogue'. Also the understanding of the big picture, the long term affects of systems that are put in place, the transience of committee members compared to the longer term permenance (spl) of staff members. Hope you cal all sort through these problems and come out the other side with a cohesive group of adults all working to THE MAIN AIM including putting any ego's and misunderstandings in the past. Peggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 I think in all these types of situations it is the need to all work towards a balance of understanding and valueing each others roles and valuing what each other does FOR THE GOOD OF THE SETTING / CHILDREN / PARENTS / STAFF. Easy to say I know, but maybe a good phrase to start any meeting from. Feelings of being undervalued, both staff and committee need to be turned around through 'professional dialogue'. Also the understanding of the big picture, the long term affects of systems that are put in place, the transience of committee members compared to the longer term permenance (spl) of staff members. Hope you cal all sort through these problems and come out the other side with a cohesive group of adults all working to THE MAIN AIM including putting any ego's and misunderstandings in the past. Peggy I really wish that life were that simple Peggy! Unfortunately there are a great many people who are only working for their own personal good and don't give a jot about professionalism or common courtesy. I have had dealings with a number of voluntary committees in recent years and have been quite shocked and upset by the way some have gone about their business. It has certainly opened my eyes and I must admit to being much more cynical nowadays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 This will be my first post on the forum l would like to add, l would at times like more involvement from committee, however as already mentioned none of members are trained in childcare/education and do leave it to myself to run pre- school . However l feel that as a manager there are some issues that the committee should be more active in, i.e fundrasing, pay increases, fee setting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beau Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 Hi cazbaby and welcome to the forum. As you have illustrated, voluntary committees are so often one extreme to another. In an ideal world everyone would pull together and share the load - heeding the advice of those more qualified and experienced but sharing the workload as much as possible. There are some committees who manage to do this but they are few and far between! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 30, 2008 Share Posted April 30, 2008 Quote from Beau "I really wish that life were that simple Peggy! Unfortunately there are a great many people who are only working for their own personal good and don't give a jot about professionalism or common courtesy." Yes, must admit Beau, wearing my 'rose tinted glasses' again. Must admit mine are very over used and wearing out, so, any political party that promises ( and keeps it's promise) to provide every citizen with a free pair of rose tinted glasses gets my vote at the upcoming local elections. I suppose it is easier for me to think positively as I am not involved with any committee's at te moment I'll just send positive vibes to all who are. Peggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hali Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 ahhh thank you Peggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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