NBBubbles

I have been caught out on the term dates before too! I emailed the advisers at Surrey to ask for next year's funded periods a few weeks ago, but I was told that this was "with the commissioners" and settings would be advised by the bulletin. Seems very late, as parents/staff need to know our term dates for next year.

Surrey have said that we cannot claim funding for children that have chosen to remain at home from the start of the spring term, until such time that they return. In our area the infection rates are extremely high, and we believe the families that have chosen to keep their pre-school age child at home (rather than the family leaving home to come into the community with older school age children in tow to come to Pre-school) are making an informed, balanced decision. Yet we are being penalised as we cannot claim funding for the child as expected, leaving us with a huge shortfall in income. If other local authorities can continue to fund their settings, why can’t Surrey? We just feel very anxious and unsupported at the moment and morale is at an all time low.

Yes as early years staff have an invisible magical cloak of protection around them from the virus. And obviously the virus cannot be transmitted by early years children, only those in primary or secondary schools.

I think it could be the HMRC reference number you use when you re-claim gift aid, my one has two letters and five numbers?

Our local authority has confirmed that under the current government guidelines, the early years funding will not be reclaimed if we chose not to re-open, or if we only open for a limited number of children each day! Thought this may be useful information for you all!

I I agree with you! The way I have calculated it seems fair to me and if challenged in the future I have all the information as to why I worked it out this way. The guidance has been confusing for even an accountant to understand, so there should be some flexibility with percentages surely. In February we didn't receive any fees or funding, as our parents pay up front in January and the funding comes in before the start of term in January. So I took the whole income we have received and will receive in funding from our LA for the whole year, then worked out the total amount of fees and donations we would have received if this year we had stayed open unaffected by closure. I added the two together and then worked out the total divided by the amount of fees/donations- this came to 34%. I then worked out our total monthly payroll bill total. I worked out 34% of that. Our accountant says we can furlough enough staff up to that total, using the net amount of 80% of their wages. e.g. if someone earns gross £1,000 a month, then only count £800 a month towards the furlough amount. Doing it this way we will manage to furlough 4 staff out of 8 staff. I am sure some will tell me it's not correct way of working it out, but for 3 weeks now I have played around with it, and if I have managed to sleep then my first waking thought is "FURLOUGH!!". So I've had a long chat with our accountant and he feels that this is appropriate and fair, should we be questioned over it in the future.

Ah, that's because I thought we could furlough staff up to 25% of our wage bill - so up to £2,500 and then work out how many staff (at 80% of their wages) come to £2,500. Otherwise we are not getting 25% of our wage bill, we are getting 80% of our wage bill and then 25% of that

So ........ If your income from private fees and fundraising is £30,000 and your income from funding is 90,000 then you have total income of £120,000. £30,000 is therefore 25% of your total income for the pre-school or nursery. So as you still receive the funding you are 'short' by 25% of your total income. So if your monthly wage bill is say £10,000, you can furlough staff to the amount of £2,500.00. The next bit is where I am lost - as it is the gross salary for your employee/s plus national insurance contributions and pension contributions, so I don't know how to work out how many staff we can furlough to get near to the amount (for us our private income makes up 34% of our total income including funding). How do you work out what the gross salary plus NI contributions would be? And do you take each member of staff's gross income and then work out 80& of their salary and by juggling with the staff who earn different amounts, try to come up with staff whose 80% of salary = the amount of furlough money we can apply for? I don't think I even understand what I'm asking!

Thanks everyone for your ideas and examples. I did one of the Early Years Alliance Connect meetings (by zoom) today - we received an invitation to sign-up for one of these on a generic email a couple of weeks ago. The EYA said they are developing a 'calculator' that will enable settings to input their income split between fees and funding, together with their payroll figures etc and it will provide the amount we can furlough staff up to. They hope for this to be launched within the next 24 hours, given the urgency as we are approaching our April payroll date. Prior to today, I calculated the total amount we will receive in early years funding for this academic year, together with the total amount we would have received in fees for the same period if we hadn't closed, to work out the percentage of fees to funding. This comes to 34% fees, so assumed we could furlough up to 34% of our monthly wages for staff. However, now I don't think it is as simple as that!

If you receive mainly funding for the summer term and only a fraction of your income for the term is fee income, then you will be in a favourable position. You will still receive all the early years funding income you would normally and you can furlough your staff up to the amount of fee income you would have received. So you will not lose out. It seems fair to me that if settings still receive their early years funding, they can't also be reimbursed for their staff wages too (by furloughing all of them) but they should only receive what they would have lost out on, by being closed and not receiving the fee income fees. Otherwise there would be a lot of settings showing a surplus at their year-end. So you can furlough the staff up to the amount of income that you would have lost.

It means that if your setting receives 35% in fees and 65% in funding, then you can only furlough staff up to the amount you would be losing in fee income. If you were able to furlough all or the majority of your staff and receive the early years free entitlement, then you would receive more income than you normally would - which would be too good to be true. So for the example, you would work out your monthly salary bill and calculate 35% of it. If I have understood it correctly!

As there was mixed guidance regarding furloughing staff when in receipt of public funding (i.e. for us, early years free entitlement funding), I wrote to my local (Conservative) MP. He replied last week to say he would seek clarification and has today replied to say: - "You can furlough staff who make up the same percentage of your pay bill as your percentage of private income" We receive early years funding for our FEET two year olds, three and four year olds and in the summer term have a lower percentage of families who pay fees. So this means there is a limit on the amount we can apply for, when the scheme opens to submit our reimbursement claims, which must be the same for all nurseries and pre-schools?

I asked our committee chair to call Early Years Alliance Lawcall and ask the question if staff could continue to keep in contact with families on Tapestry. We have been asking them to set up one activity each week for their key children and respond to parents who are uploading photos etc. Lawcall said no, they cannot provide any services and this would be part of their normal duties, so would not be able to continue whilst furloughed. Hope this helps!

Martin Lewis has just confirmed that you can work for another employer whilst you are furloughed, but you must not carry out any work at all for the employer who has furloughed you. He said this would be a serious breach of the furlough regulations, which has concerned me!! For me I would see any staff continuing to post activities to Tapestry as continuing to carry out 'work' for us as their employer. There would also be a 'trail' to prove staff were still 'working'.