Planning - How Long Should It Take?

[Guest]

Hi I have general planning query. The last girl who did my job did all the plans for the week in under 2 hours!

After doing all the daily activities (10 with extensions and differentiations) the medium term at the start of the month. The overview for the week with all equipment and ELG's, reviewed the observations I am running at nearly 4 hours! I only get paid for 2 and before approaching the owner about this thought I would find out how long it tool everyone else. This time does not include all the sheets and other resources I produce in my own time.

I know teachers get 4 hours non contact is this correct? - thanks x

[Susan]

Hi and welcome bluemandie!

 

Teachers now get a minimum 10% PPA time---planning, preparation and assessment.

 

How long your planning should take is a bit like the proverbial piece of string, but 4 hrs does not seem excessive for that amount of work but your workload may well be!

[Guest]

Thanks - Well I firstly collect all the children's observations through and use them to inform next weeks planning. I then choose a balance between topic work and following the children's interests. Once i have chosen these with the goals I then write up the activities 10. The weekly plan also takes time as it is choosing the resources for the week and adding the focused activities on it. This is just so other people whom come in can easily follow the planning. If you have any ideas of how I could make this easier that would be great - x

[Guest]

Hi,

 

As a teacher I get 10% PPA per week which actually equates to a half day- 2 1/2 hours. During this time we are expected to plan, assess children and prepare for the week/ term.

 

However, in practice it always takes longer for me although it is a great help considering we never used to get any extra time.

 

From what you have said I would think it would take me about the same time to complete the work you are doing but do you need to review planning- perhaps share it across the team or cut down on the amount of focus activities to perhaps 6 per week- 1 for each area of learning?

 

Just some thoughts and good luck with your negotiations!

[Guest]

In order to cut down and make the planning of better quality I did suggest 6. As a full day care provider we have different children in on different days and I felt we could repeat activities and offer extensions for those in full time. this was met with a simple NO!

[Guest]

Hi bluemandie

 

If you are a full day provider, are you in a private day nursery? What age of children are you planning for? What is your role within the setting?

 

I work in a pdn working with children from 2-4 at the moment. We only plan 4 adult led activities per week (one per member of staff) which we each have to plan, create a lesson plan for and source resources and then evaluate. We are each given half an hour non contact each week for this - and it has to be done on the computer.

The activities 'run' until every child has at least had one chance to participate if they wish to. Each lesson plan shows a main ELG FS and BTT focus and then has to show 5 other areas of anticipated learning and 3 other BTT!? (as well as differentiation)

 

We then also support and facilitate the children's own interests/activities/role play/games etc and any spontaneous things that happen during the day/arise through child's interest. We have free flow play/activities out for children to self select what they wish to do. However, these things, seem to 'slip through the net' in terms of evaluation - which is a shame as they seem to me to be the most valuable!

 

Your planning sounds much more suitable than ours - Do you select the ELG's for the week (presumably from previously evaluated observations) and then plan activities designed to achieve/attempt the goals?

Our planning seems back to front to me, and I'd love to be able to recommend a complete change!

 

However, 10 activities per week sounds rather a lot, depending on children's age, I would have thought the opportunity/time to revisit activities independently would be more valuable than attempting 2 per day, especially for the part time children. Also sharing the planning load between a team would be better for work load and for a variety of input?

 

Sorry if I've got the wrong end of the stick and your not a day nursery.

 

Patricia

[Guest]

Not we are full day care. I feel we do, do too many activities and the children that are not in all the time sometimes cause me headaches bless them! I have an observation sheet for each child with 3 columns. One with the day of the week, the next with child's interests and finally links to ELG's. On a friday I look through the sheet and see what they have been interested in and look at any of the ELG's they have met. I keep evidence eg photos or work in a file and then once a month transfer these to the child's portfolio. I highlight the evidence I use on these forms so it is clear to see how we have assessed the children. I also have a small box at the top of the step which says 'Next steps'. This is an individual goal for the child eg wipes own nose, puts on own coat etc. I feel these sheets work well and use them to inform my folllowing weeks planning eg if john enjoys the dinsoaurs i could plan an actvitiy around this interest etc. I hope this makes sense? xx

 

Sorry I also use the medium term planning for some of the ELG's I try and cover these by choosing a cross section throughout the month. xx

[Guest]

your planning sounds the same as mine, i care for 3 and 4 year olds i have between 4 and 6 focussed activities per week which i have to do lesson plans for, i also have to add any new activities that are on the shelves and print a breakdown version for displaying for parents. unfortunatly i work alone and presently do not get any child free time to do the planning. it comes home with me and i generally look at my observations and record what they tell me on friday night and then finish printing up my planning for the week on sunday afternoon (something i definatly will be addressing when i take over the role of managing the nursery which should be in feb). at the beginning of each month medium planning is sone which outlines what stepping stones i aim to focus on in that month. any spontaneous activities are also recorded and evaluated i hope this makes sense xjojmx

Edited December 31, 2006 by Guest

[Guest]

Bluemandie, do you have access to a support teacher from the L.E.A who could advise. It would be very professional of you to use them!!! and I think you would find they would advise 6 focus activities as you are likely to be directing the children far too much.

[Guest]

i do use an advisory teacher, four to six activities really is managable for me and for the children. within the montessori enviromment it is not uncommon to have several activities going at the same time the only problem i have is time for planning. do you think i am doing too much for the children, sometimes activities will run for a few weeks and the children choose wether or not they wish to take part

[Guest]

Jojom

I suggested use of an advisory teacher so that she could support what you are trying to achieve if the powers that be are demanding what is unreasonable. I only know that when you balance activities well you see children putting into practice what you have been teaching independently and they need the time to do this. if you are calling them to do this activity and that activity, they lose time to consolidate and you lose the chance to observe and work out where they are truly at. You are the best judge of that.

My advice was for Bluemandie and not meant as criticism but more as a ways and means that could be used to support your ideas when approaching owners and managers who may not have as much knowledge as they think they have.Hence the exclamation marks.

[Guest]

I do use an advisory support teacher. However I have in the past put forward suggestions but they have been rejected - unfortunately for me! One of the main problems I have in doing so many activities is that it is very hard to plan for the children whom come just twice a week. Less activities would mean I could repeat when these children are in for the day. I think however I just will have to accept my setting wants 10 activities and ain't budging! xx

[Sue R]

Hi there!

 

Sorry to have missed this thus far - I feel 10 activities (I assume, focus-type : fully planned etc, evaluations assessments et al ? ) is excessive. We have one a day, with all other staff fully engaged with the children and their CI stuff, thus there are lots of spontaneous obs possible and better monitoring of children's interests to help your forward planning.

 

Please let us know how things pan out for you in the long term - I would be inclined to gnaw away at this one!!

 

Sue

[Guest]

Hi

 

I agree with Sue 10 planned activities is a lot. We do 1 planned activity per day with this usually lasting over the entire week. We have 46 children in all together and not all of these come in everyday so we need to make sure we include everyone over the week - how many children do you have on the role and are they all getting a chance to join in with all 10 activities - I am also interested to know how you manage this staff wise as well?

 

Deb

[hali]

we do one planned activity each session 10 does seem a lot to do

[cinderella1]

It takes me a good four hours if not longer

 

by the way teachers get 10 percent which works out at 2.5hrs if we are lucky to plan, assess and prepare. No where near long enough, but if you are only paid for two hours to cover all those areas daily, I would def say no where near long enough. I plan for about the same and outdoor activities plus whole class sessions of an extra 3 a day.

[Guest]

I feel I must add to this - Yes, teachers do get the equivalent to 2.5 hours to do planning etc, however they are on a salary (and in most cases a lot more than early years practitioners in day care who get paid hourly) and are only with the children from 9-3 (roughly) so have time outside of these hours to do extra work. Many staff in day care work with the children between 8-6, so do need the exact time it takes (and Paid) to be able to do all of the paper work tasks. I wouldn't say that 4 hours was an unreasonable request.

I ahve 6 adult led activities each week (one for each area of the curriculum), and repeat these over the sessions.

[Guest]

I am preschool, I used to spend weekends planning for the following week. I now have a long term plan which indicates which aspects of the curriculum we will focus on during the following week ( ensures a balance of all the curriculum over the year).

Little time is needed on short term plans because we do the 'retrospectively' as we go along, jotting notes during the session on to the following weeks planning sheet. This incorporates childrens interests linked to the long term plan learning focus, notes on individual childrens next step which informs adult led plans for the next day or week.

 

I have built up a good resource bank, in boxes headed under the six areas of learning, activity plans, ideas, games, etc so resourcing time to meet retrospective planning has reduced as well.

 

We ahve found since planning from the children our workload in terms of out of hours time has drastically rduced and the children seem more relaxed, happy and have their learning styles and needs accomodated by the adults

 

Peggy

 

rather than following a plan where the adult has decided which way (activity) they will experience or consolidate a particular knowledge, concept or skill.

[Marion]

Have to agree Peggy my weekends and evenings were taken up with planning evaluations etc. and working from the children means that our planning has been streamlined. Also since we became a FSU and plan as a team sharing ideas helps hugely with planning.

[Guest Wolfie]

I'm going to have to seriously get my head round planning from the children - it all sounds right and such a sensible development but such a big change and out of everybody's comfort zone! I think I need to find a nursery nearby and go and experinece it first hand,....that's my learning style!

[Guest]

Good idea Wolfie, I'm similar being an 'active / experiencial ' learner myself

 

Every setting is individual and can take on board or dismiss ideas as appropriatte. Maybe with the change over to EYFS it would be best to incorporate new methods alongside this 'required' change, rather than change now, then change again as you try to fit practice into new learning of the EYFS model. If you see what I mean.

 

Peggy

[Guest Wolfie]

In the main nursery where I'm based, we have 120 children passing through everyday - 60 in the morning and a different 60 in the afternoon - how workable do you think it would be when these numbers are involved?

[Marion]

We are a FSU with 56 children morning and 56 afternoon so it should be workable. Its a good idea to visit other settings to see how they work even if its to say that isn't for us or to take away bits of good practice to adapt to your needs

[Sue R]

Wolfie, where in Staffs are you, exactly?

 

Half a plan forming.....

 

 

Sue

[Guest Wolfie]

I work in Walsall.....