Guest Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Hi, I am new to the forum and wondered if anyone could help me as I am at my wit's end!! I have four or five aggressive boys in my Reception class. They argue, bite, kick, spit etc and not just on the playground. I have tried circle times, positive reinforcement, 'catch 'em when they are good,' star charts both at home and at school for individuals and class etc. One of the boys is a colleague's son, who works in key stage 2, which has been quite difficult at times! They are rude to other members of staff, including the Headteacher and nothing seems to phase them. One of the boys had to be collected from school at lunchtimes because of his poor behaviour. They are reprimanded for this by missing playtimes, sent to other members of staff etc and then the following day they are at it again. Any good ideas out there to tackle these problems? Thanks Tomtom21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Hi Tomtom and welcome! sounds like your days are very difficult at the moment and that you have tried a range of strategies. I cant think of any alternatives at the moment except that you obviously need your head on board and the parents. I would try keeping a daily diary or log to see if you can identify any triggers and also as a record of your interventions etc in case you need to seek outside agency support. It may be that you are doing this already? Have you involved your Senco? I think it couldbe worth your while looking back at the stategies that you have used and choosing one and sticking with it for a considerable period. If you use a sticker chart, you need to be rewarding at very frequent intervals, which can be very time consuming. But I would think it is worth perserving with one as you have obviously tried alot of things in quite a short space of time, although it will feel like forever to you! Good luck with this and keep these boys apart!!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 My sympathies! I've got a few difficult boys but they are not revolting all the time. You must feel at your wits end, so many ideas tried as Susan said. One that mine sometimes respond to is a laminated picture of a traffic light, after a first warning for something serious their name goes up against a green light, then moves to amber, then red. Peer group pressure supports this quite well as the other children frown on someone having their name up there. We usually send the child to head or deputy if they get to a red and talk to parents too. I wonder whether it would increase effectiveness to have some sort of small sanction for the other two lights. The other thing we have is a whole school reward system. If a child is particularly well behaved they are given a yellow slip which details what was good. This goes into a box and a name is drawn out each week in whole school assembly and the winner is able to negotiate a reward (picnic lunch outdoors with friends, bringing in a special game to play at lunch time with a select group etc). The children are also given another slip with the same details which is bluetacked up on a wall in the school's entrance for the week and is then taken home the following Monday. It does seem to motivate the children well throughout the school. Although with older ones there is some debate about miscreants who suddenly behave getting one more easily than those who are good all the time Keep your chin up! Angela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Hi Tomtom 21, Perhaps you could look at what they particularly enjoy doing or ask them. Then, take a digital picture of this and cut it in to jigsaw pieces. The child is given a piece of the jigsaw for good behaviour and when they have all the pieces they are rewarded by special time to spend on their favourite activity. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 10, 2005 Share Posted May 10, 2005 Dear Tomtom My sympathies - I've got a Reception class like that too - the Nursery teacher said she had never come across anything remotely like them in all her years of teaching and that they were impossible. A couple of weeks ago one of mine tried to strangle the other and we had great difficulty removing his hands from the other child's neck - then apart from the usual biting, scratching, kicking etc. a child nearly glued another's eyes with the glue stick, threw milk over everybody (thought only Cleopatra bathed in milk!) and when the 'expert' from the LEA came to see she was drenched with water and watched with horror as black and red paint was being tipped up - she left very rapidly. One of the worst times was before Open Evening when one of them had a fit, pulled down the wall displays and tipped up all the toys. I tried everything everybody suggested but the most successful has been 'time to talk' a social skills group I run once a week with the 5 offenders and the concepts are carried over into the class, circle time etc. We have covered sharing, good listening, empathy etc. They do seem to be slowly responding to this and things are improving. Time to talk' is a social skills programme and we use the book, bear and game. The parents get a note of what we are doing and ideas of how to incorporate the concept at home. Next year's class seem very docile compared to the current cohort which is one consolation!!! Ruthanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Ive only ever experienced the extremes of behaviour that you both describe in children with needs that were eventually identifed as needing specialist provision. It was hard work keeping them contained in the classroom and we got to a point in school when we felt that only way we could deal with the problems was short term exclusion. That felt really dreadful in Reception but it made the LEA sit up, take notice and act. This was always a last resort but my head felt that it was the only way to deal with the child when other children and adults were being hurt. We had specialists in running play therapy sessions and raising self esteem but these measures only temporarily relieved the situation. Whatever happens, you must not feel that you have failed. It is not your fault that these things occur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Hi, I am new to the forum and wondered if anyone could help me as I am at my wit's end!! I have four or five aggressive boys in my Reception class. They argue, bite, kick, spit etc and not just on the playground. I have tried circle times, positive reinforcement, 'catch 'em when they are good,' star charts both at home and at school for individuals and class etc. One of the boys is a colleague's son, who works in key stage 2, which has been quite difficult at times! They are rude to other members of staff, including the Headteacher and nothing seems to phase them. One of the boys had to be collected from school at lunchtimes because of his poor behaviour. They are reprimanded for this by missing playtimes, sent to other members of staff etc and then the following day they are at it again. Any good ideas out there to tackle these problems?Thanks Tomtom21 31636[/snapback] Thanks for this message Susan. Have involved the senco and she is aware of these children. We have no real outdoor play area apart from the playground and this is shared by key stage 1 and 2 because we are in the process of having a new building. We have very little outdoor equipment apart from P.E equipment and it is difficult t get out recently (Sats etc so we have to be quiet !!) Anyway,hopefully some of these issues will disappear when we move in to a new classroom (and I have a new class!!) Tomtom21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Dear TomtomMy sympathies - I've got a Reception class like that too - the Nursery teacher said she had never come across anything remotely like them in all her years of teaching and that they were impossible. A couple of weeks ago one of mine tried to strangle the other and we had great difficulty removing his hands from the other child's neck - then apart from the usual biting, scratching, kicking etc. a child nearly glued another's eyes with the glue stick, threw milk over everybody (thought only Cleopatra bathed in milk!) and when the 'expert' from the LEA came to see she was drenched with water and watched with horror as black and red paint was being tipped up - she left very rapidly. One of the worst times was before Open Evening when one of them had a fit, pulled down the wall displays and tipped up all the toys. I tried everything everybody suggested but the most successful has been 'time to talk' a social skills group I run once a week with the 5 offenders and the concepts are carried over into the class, circle time etc. We have covered sharing, good listening, empathy etc. They do seem to be slowly responding to this and things are improving. Time to talk' is a social skills programme and we use the book, bear and game. The parents get a note of what we are doing and ideas of how to incorporate the concept at home. Next year's class seem very docile compared to the current cohort which is one consolation!!! Ruthanne 31649[/snapback] Thanks for this!! It really cheered me up today. We have just started Time to talk with the children, but we do it in groups of 5 or 6 and the whole class take part. They do seem to enjoy the teamwork concept and it has improved tidy up times, when some of them work together. I'm visiting playgroup next week to meet some of the new children so I'm crossing everything! Tomtom21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Hi Tomtom 21, Perhaps you could look at what they particularly enjoy doing or ask them. Then, take a digital picture of this and cut it in to jigsaw pieces. The child is given a piece of the jigsaw for good behaviour and when they have all the pieces they are rewarded by special time to spend on their favourite activity. Good luck! 31648[/snapback] Dear Matilda, Haven't tried this idea yet so I'll give it a go. (Try anything once!!) Tomtom21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 I empathise with you and am afraid I don't have any further suggestions to add other thatn role-modelling situations. I did want to reinforce Ruthanne's point abput the 'time to talk' programme. We began to use it as so many of our children have poor language skills (despite an excellent year of input in our nursery!). It has really helped the childrento develop the socila nad language skills to deal with situations ads they arise. I dealt with a playground issue today- I had heard loads of tales, nad children not getting on as well as usual. I ended up standing on a chair ('the climbing frame' ) with a teaching assisstant telling me they wanted me to jump and me replying that I wanted to stay a minute longer anf then I would be down to play - (as opposed to the child at playtime who kicked the boy who asked her!) We find that we have to do lots of role modelling situations (using adults and children) to help the children work out what they need to say and do in situations! Marie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 My sympathies! I've got a few difficult boys but they are not revolting all the time. You must feel at your wits end, so many ideas tried as Susan said. One that mine sometimes respond to is a laminated picture of a traffic light, after a first warning for something serious their name goes up against a green light, then moves to amber, then red. Peer group pressure supports this quite well as the other children frown on someone having their name up there. We usually send the child to head or deputy if they get to a red and talk to parents too. I wonder whether it would increase effectiveness to have some sort of small sanction for the other two lights. The other thing we have is a whole school reward system. If a child is particularly well behaved they are given a yellow slip which details what was good. This goes into a box and a name is drawn out each week in whole school assembly and the winner is able to negotiate a reward (picnic lunch outdoors with friends, bringing in a special game to play at lunch time with a select group etc). The children are also given another slip with the same details which is bluetacked up on a wall in the school's entrance for the week and is then taken home the following Monday. It does seem to motivate the children well throughout the school. Although with older ones there is some debate about miscreants who suddenly behave getting one more easily than those who are good all the time Keep your chin up! Angela 31643[/snapback] Hi, Angela, Thanks for the ideas. I have heard about this traffic light strategy but haven't used it yet. I have just started a new reward system, where the children write their names on the board when they have been good for some reason but they can only take a sticker home that day(if not they have to wait until the following day) if they have been good throughout the day without aggression etc and this seems to be working so far quite well. Tomtom21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2005 Share Posted May 11, 2005 Sympathies to Tomtom, we have a little girl in our nursery and she causes chaos, the group is so different when she is away. Can we have more info about the Time to talk - it sounds interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2005 Share Posted May 12, 2005 I'd like to know more about Time to Talk, too, please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magenta Posted May 12, 2005 Share Posted May 12, 2005 I was lucky enough to receive the 'Time to talk game' as a free gift from the I CAN website. http://www.ican.org.uk/ Haven't tried it yet, but will post a review when I have. Alison Schroeder's book is available from Amazon. http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/1...2789916-8915066 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2005 Share Posted May 12, 2005 Lots of empathy from me too. I agree with others responses and will be looking at the "Time to talk" method. Are the "boys" difficult altogether in a "gang" one starting off another etc? One idea which you may have already tried is to give them individual responsibilities, ie: calling the register, setting up for snacks etc, so that the other children can see that they can be "helpful" members of the class. A side effect of difficult behaviour is the "label" the child then gets, from peers, teachers and parents, so the behaviour then becomes a predisposed expectation. (if you know what I mean). This is only human nature and if we are honest we all feel this way sometimes, it's just good to acknowledge it now and again. I love the jigsaw idea, that's a new one to me. I once had a girl in Nursery who would stab anyone sitting next to her,( even with an adult right beside her, she moved really fast) she would attack them with pencils, scissors, anything to hand, no apparent trigger either and then laugh She once got hold of a child by the hair pulled him to the floor and tried to stamp on his head ( luckily she missed). I don't believe suspension or expulsion helps ( although we did think of it for the safety of others). We tried everything and asked for specialist child psychology support, unfortunatley this took a year to be put into place and by then she had moved on to school. In the meantime I asked her parents to stay at preschool with her for some of the time. I heard that within her 1st month at school she killed the class hamster, took him out the cage and threw him to the ground. So if it's any consolation, maybe this scenario will help you see your boys as little angels. Peggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2005 Share Posted May 12, 2005 Thank you everybody for the advice and sympathy. I have a full-time LSA for the most difficult child - the one who tried to strangle other children, and yes he's tried stabbing and offered to sharpen the pencils so that he could 'poke them in everybody's eyes'. He's bitten and scratched children really badly and one practitioner went home wiht gashes down her arms where he attacked her. The classroom fish suffered when he tried to take them out of the bowl - to eat!!! Various reports are being done by outside agencies and I do agree that suspension - unless by the feet for a great length of time - oops did I really type that - would not help him and would be so hard for his mother. They are not a gang or a group and the problem with always giving them responsibility is that it is hard on the rest of the class as they get so much attention anyway. Time to talk has been going for a term and been very effective. If you have any doubts about social skills groups a Y5 mother came up to me in tears today. She wanted to thank me as the days when I had withdrawn her son for the social skills group, were the only days in months that they had a 'normal' happy child and therefore family life as his behaviour impacts on the siblings. Play therapy sounds a wonderful idea. Does anybody know how I can obtain it for our school - we are a Brent state school? Thank you again, Ruthanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 13, 2005 Share Posted May 13, 2005 I empathise with you and am afraid I don't have any further suggestions to add other thatn role-modelling situations. I did want to reinforce Ruthanne's point abput the 'time to talk' programme. We began to use it as so many of our children have poor language skills (despite an excellent year of input in our nursery!). It has really helped the childrento develop the socila nad language skills to deal with situations ads they arise.I dealt with a playground issue today- I had heard loads of tales, nad children not getting on as well as usual. I ended up standing on a chair ('the climbing frame' ) with a teaching assisstant telling me they wanted me to jump and me replying that I wanted to stay a minute longer anf then I would be down to play - (as opposed to the child at playtime who kicked the boy who asked her!) We find that we have to do lots of role modelling situations (using adults and children) to help the children work out what they need to say and do in situations! Marie 31704[/snapback] Thanks for this suggestion Marie. Will try this in a few situations but I might get arrested if I model some of their actions!! Tomtom21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 Hi, is it just me ? or do you all think that we seem to have a lot more children with behaviour problems ?. I have worked in Pre school and Reception now, and after meeting the next group of children joining us in Reception ( both Pre-school and full time Reception ) we are getting even more challenging little angels in our setting.I have been working with statmented children and those who have not yet got a statement in place ( usually due to the fact that despite the obvious ,the parent/ parents involved refuse to see that there is a problem ) and it worries me greatly; whilst being tentativly in favour of inclusion I do feel that in certain cases it cannot work in the big scheme of things.I have been looking after a child with ? something on Aspergers ? somewhere on the Autistic spectrum and a smattering of ADHD and this child is due to move up to Yr 1 in Sept. he has no statement !. Without a statement he will receive no extra help officially ,however, this year he has been given 1 to 1 between 9am and 11.30am due to the fact that our Class could not have functioned otherwise for the benefit of the other 29 children involved.I have now been told that I shall be moving to Yr 1 but there is no other info available as to which class I shall be with, I`m now wondering if I am moving up to provide continuity for the child and a cheap option for ensuring that the child still gets the 1 to 1 that he most definitely needs or wether I shall be going up as a Teaching Asst(1 to 1 Special Needs assts earn a lot more than your average C.A. or T.A.) Unfortunately it all seems to be down to ££££ again; which at the end of the day makes me wonder are we really looking after the interests of the individual child ? and by WE I mean the government and the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 Hi, I am new to the forum and wondered if anyone could help me as I am at my wit's end!! I have four or five aggressive boys in my Reception class. They argue, bite, kick, spit etc and not just on the playground. I have tried circle times, positive reinforcement, 'catch 'em when they are good,' star charts both at home and at school for individuals and class etc. One of the boys is a colleague's son, who works in key stage 2, which has been quite difficult at times! They are rude to other members of staff, including the Headteacher and nothing seems to phase them. One of the boys had to be collected from school at lunchtimes because of his poor behaviour. They are reprimanded for this by missing playtimes, sent to other members of staff etc and then the following day they are at it again. Any good ideas out there to tackle these problems?Thanks Tomtom21 31636[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 Hi I find Circle Time a brilliant way to discuss behaviour problems. Choose a favoured cuddly/class mascot etc. and as long as the child is holding it then they control the discussion,this gives the children the sense that they are IN control and they can talk about whatever they want.Using this method means that with adult direction the discussion can develop the way you want it to and hopefully achieve the results you want, ie. What the children see as `bad` or inappropriate behaviour, how can we help each other be `good `friends etc. ; also in these sessions you can `Buddy Up` certain children to help reinforce good behaviour and instill a friendly class enviroment where the children are encouraged to look out for each other.At the end of the week I ask the children to decide who has been a good/helpful/supportive friend and ALL those nominated receive a `special` sticker.Hope this helps, if not then have a good half term holiday and best wishes for the next!!!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 SORRY feeling very dim have tried the ICAN link but cannot find the info on Time to Talk can any one guide me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alisonjayne Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 Hi I find Circle Time a brilliant way to discuss behaviour problems. Choose a favoured cuddly/class mascot etc. and as long as the child is holding it then they control the discussion,this gives the children the sense that they are IN control and they can talk about whatever they want.Using this method means that with adult direction the discussion can develop the way you want it to and hopefully achieve the results you want, ie. What the children see as `bad` or inappropriate behaviour, how can we help each other be `good `friends etc. ; also in these sessions you can `Buddy Up` certain children to help reinforce good behaviour and instill a friendly class enviroment where the children are encouraged to look out for each other.At the end of the week I ask the children to decide who has been a good/helpful/supportive friend and ALL those nominated receive a `special` sticker.Hope this helps, if not then have a good half term holiday and best wishes for the next!!!. 32515[/snapback] I love circle times normally, but have a child a t the moment who will usually use this time to poke,punch,nip,scratch.... anyone nearby. So have not been able to use it for that purpose. However maybe my love of circle times will be restored as today for the first time the child did join in a short circle time which involved making a spiders web with wool between the children. This particular child ran about at the begining then came and plonked down on top of a couple of children. Eventually the child realized that the only way to be part of the circle time was to move back and join the circle. Has anybody got any other short visual circle time activities which might help! We have tried ball rolling, and passing the puppet and the hoop over the body, but these seemed to trigger of the aggresive behaviour. Ali Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 I love circle times normally, but have a child a t the moment who will usually use this time to poke,punch,nip,scratch.... anyone nearby. So have not been able to use it for that purpose. However maybe my love of circle times will be restored as today for the first time the child did join in a short circle time which involved making a spiders web with wool between the children. This particular child ran about at the begining then came and plonked down on top of a couple of children. Eventually the child realized that the only way to be part of the circle time was to move back and join the circle. Has anybody got any other short visual circle time activities which might help! We have tried ball rolling, and passing the puppet and the hoop over the body, but these seemed to trigger of the aggresive behaviour. Ali 32549[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 32563[/snapback] Hi, in our setting we encourage certain children to sit on a mat, the one we use for a child very similar to yours is in the image of a ladybird ( he is into `bugs`) although this is not 100% successful it does give him his own `space` and he does respond to being asked to sit on his `special mat`, we do have to make sure none of the other children are on / too near it as this causes a few problems but nothing like before when he did not have his own `space`.Maybe worth a try ?!. The mats that we use at the moment are from IKEA however any interesting mats / carpet / rug type of things would suit the purpose.Hope this helps, karen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 We use the TIme to Talk programme, with 2 groups of 4-6 children, who needed most listening/communicating/taking turns support. The children have followed the activites with support assistants and one child gets a 'best listener' certificate' each session, which is shared with the rest of the class for a clap. There is quite a lot of resource preparation, and we have our own set of bears that the activities are based around (from the Bear factory / or Ebay). We have repeated/adjusted some of the activities as the children work through to reinforce certain aspects of the programme. i've found a link to the guidance book which is very clear to follow. http://www.theresourcecupboard.com/product...ype=bestsellers Marie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Hi, in our setting we encourage certain children to sit on a mat, the one we use for a child very similar to yours is in the image of a ladybird ( he is into `bugs`) although this is not 100% successful it does give him his own `space` and he does respond to being asked to sit on his `special mat`, we do have to make sure none of the other children are on / too near it as this causes a few problems but nothing like before when he did not have his own `space`.Maybe worth a try ?!. The mats that we use at the moment are from IKEA however any interesting mats / carpet / rug type of things would suit the purpose.Hope this helps, karen 32568[/snapback] Thanks for the reply. I have also a little boy in my class with what seems the same as you have in yours ( ADHD) . We have had a psychologist in a couple of times to observe him and the senco is aware of him but nothing has been done so far with support. It usually takes this long to sort out and then hey presto he suddenly receives it in year one!! Hope you don't get the same class again for your own sanity and good luck!! Amanda(Tomtom21) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alisonjayne Posted May 27, 2005 Share Posted May 27, 2005 Hi, in our setting we encourage certain children to sit on a mat, the one we use for a child very similar to yours is in the image of a ladybird ( he is into `bugs`) although this is not 100% successful it does give him his own `space` and he does respond to being asked to sit on his `special mat`, we do have to make sure none of the other children are on / too near it as this causes a few problems but nothing like before when he did not have his own `space`.Maybe worth a try ?!. The mats that we use at the moment are from IKEA however any interesting mats / carpet / rug type of things would suit the purpose.Hope this helps, karen 32568[/snapback] Thanks for the advice, we have just had the area senco in who is in the process of writing up the report of her meeting and observations on Thursday. She had talked about having a special place to sit, but that was at snack or lunch time. I will definitely try your suggestion, he's not into bugs, but is very creative so maybe he could produce his own mat, giving him a real sense of ownership. Will let you know how it goes. Ali Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alisonjayne Posted May 27, 2005 Share Posted May 27, 2005 We use the TIme to Talk programme, with 2 groups of 4-6 children, who needed most listening/communicating/taking turns support. The children have followed the activites with support assistants and one child gets a 'best listener' certificate' each session, which is shared with the rest of the class for a clap. There is quite a lot of resource preparation, and we have our own set of bears that the activities are based around (from the Bear factory / or Ebay). We have repeated/adjusted some of the activities as the children work through to reinforce certain aspects of the programme. i've found a link to the guidance book which is very clear to follow.http://www.theresourcecupboard.com/product...ype=bestsellers Marie 32630[/snapback] Thanks for the response, The book sounds great, We have had the Area Senco in who has sugested that we try to get him to interact with one or two people and build the group up gradually, would these work with that small a group. Ali Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basilbrush Posted May 28, 2005 Share Posted May 28, 2005 this should take you to the page about 'time to talk': http://www.ldalearning.com/scripts/detail....temCode=LL01269 ://http://www.ldalearning.com/scripts/...de=LL01269 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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