Committee Problems

[hali]

wise words as usual peggy

[Guest]

Sound advice from everyone. Just wanted to wish you well. I am with Shirel and Jessica - I wouldn't want to work in a voluntary committee-run group again.

[JacquieL]

Lot's of love and support from me too. You have been given very good advice, and I know that this is a very difficult time for you, it is so hard to be treated like this when you know that you are in the right and know how much you care about your job. Do look at this ACAS url (already given above) as they should be following proper procedures and they are not.

http://www.acas.org.uk/media/pdf/s/g/acas_...ry_folder_1.pdf

Take care.

[Guest]

Thank you for all your good advice and support. I have looked at a few websites. The chairperson has all our personal records and contracts at her house, so I don't know if there is a grievance procedure, I have never signed one.

 

Even if this is resolved I can't see how I can continue to work with a chairperson who offers me no support!

[Guest]

You should have been given a copy of the settings disciplinary and grievance procedures with your contract.

[narnia]

.............and it's not on for the chairperson to have your records at her house.These are confidential records which MUST be kept at the setting, so she's breaking all the rules on this matter. make sure you get some proper advice about this, i promise you committees can be an absolute nightmare......and i know this from bitter, bitter experience.Watch your back! good luck xx

[Andreamay]

Our grievence precedure is on the notice board our chair put it up 3 years ago after a staff grievence.

so got a feeling it HAS to be displayed.

[Guest]

I wish you all the luck in the world, i know what commitee's can be like!!!! Our greviance procedure is in our operational folder with all our polices and procedures, each staff member is given one when they receive their contracr of employment. You are entitled to have your early years development worker or advisor with you, have you phoned her yet. When i had a problem with the committee she came and sat in the meeting. Don't forget to get someone to minute this meeting or take in a dictaphone to record it, if you go down the dictaphone route, remember to get everyone to agree on the tape that the meeting can be recorded.

You must have someone to back your corner.... Good Luck with it.... keep smiling... or as the song says... always look on the bright side of life!!!!!

[dublinbay]

No further advice to offer. Just wanted to wish you well. While our committee at the moment is good we have gone through ones that have been nightmares. I'm also very concious that this could change from term to term.

 

I love the way people on this forum really come together to give their support and love to those in need. The advice has not been short in coming and I feel it is most sincere.

 

Good luck to you Mcfletch and I pray it is all sorted very soon to your satisfaction. Many hugs. xxxx

[HappyMaz]

And remember that you have a right to be accompanied (but that person doesn't have a right to intervene in the meeting). You shouldn't have to go through this alone unless you feel confident to do so (and your support person can write everything down for you - including who said what - so that you can review afterwards because you may lose focus if you feel under pressure or under attack).

 

I think ACAS also has a helpline where you can ring up and tell them exactly what has happened and they will help you. Your committee chair should probably have done this too and then she wouldn't find herself in this extremely serious situation. It would be very hard to recruit a new leader for your group if you were to take them to an industrial tribunal, after all!

 

Try to keep in mind that you are an effective, professional leader who deserves far better treatment than your committee (as a whole) seems unable to provide you with at present. It can be difficult to lose sight of yourself and all your wonderful personal qualities at a time like this because you get caught up in the emotion of what you are going through.

 

Excuse the latin - and apologies any offence caused for the imminent profanity - but my motto is

 

"no le illegitmi carborundum"

don't let the bastards grind you down.

 

I'm so angry on your behalf I could spit!

 

Take care

Maz

[Guest]

Thank you so much for your support I feel loads better. I have asked committee to write information regarding the meeting down for me rather than verbally. Staff are all willing to make written statements. I am going to go back to work tomorrow, so I will let you know what happens next xxx

[Andreamay]

yes I was thinking that maz, about maybe ringing acas (lawcall) as when we had staff grievences 3 years ago they were brilliant in advising the right procedure for the committee so i presume they will for staff too!so might be worth ringing mcfletch

glad your feeling better though

Edited November 28, 2007 by Andreamay

[Susan]

How's things, Mcfletch?

[Deb]

Susan you read my mind. I was wondering how you were getting on McFletch today too?

[Guest]

Not good, the PLA advised the vice chair, secretary and treasurer to carry out their grievance procedure against me! Pla are being helpful to committee but not me really. It is a bit of a waiting game at the moment which is awful. I feel like the committee are enjoying the drama in a away! They have rung up insurance company in case it goes to court, which is really scary! Feel like walking out but have worked hard to reach high standards. The staff are all very supportive, which has been a help. Was hoping it would all be over by christmas but looks like it will drag on and on. I am not really speaking to chairperson apart from being polite.

[Guest]

Have you contacted the Citizens Advice Bureau? There was a situation in a group I worked in a while back and the PLA supported the Chairman and committee but, the CAB supported the Supervisor. It was a horrible situation as it went to an industrial tribunal and we, the rest of the staff had to go as witnesses.

[Guest]

No I haven't yet because I keep hoping it will blow over.

[Guest]

We have no written constitution so am trying to work out if i can ditch committee in future(if I have a future) as I can't face this happening again. The member of staff wants a written apology and chairperson says just do it. I would if I thought that would solve things, but this could be seen as an admission of my guilt and used against me!

[Susan]

Oh dear, sorry to hear that. Hope you have someone to support and advise you.

Keep strong.

[Susan]

Written apology, have you discovered what for?

 

You could write an openended letter, something like sorry the situation that arose upset you?

 

Take some action, dont wait to get yourself support and advise. Good luck.

[Deb]

A written apology for something you did not do would only be a short term fix, it would not solve this problem. Please do not be bullied into it. It must be hard to do, I know. I have had to stand up to my chairperson this week over an issue, backed by staff and financial committee, and it made me feel very shakey and anxious all week but sometimes you have to make a stand for the sake of your own self-esteem. Be strong!

 

You have the support of the other staff, keep reminding yourself of that. You have the support of the Forum which money cannot buy!

 

Have the PLA spoken to you? When you say the PLA have been advised to use the grievance procedure against you, who said that? Are you sure, it is not just a case of words be slightly changed and actually what the PLA advisor said was something along the lines of advisng them to follow their grievance procedure, which they should do. There is a world of difference.

 

This needs to be discussed formally in a proper and fair meeting, with someone supporting you in addition to the staff. Ask for a quick and speedy resolution to this problem or you'll start grievance procedure against them. I'll feel like coming over and sorting them out!

[HappyMaz]

I would be very wary of writing a letter of apology - it could be used against you in a disciplinary hearing and might ultimately give the committee a reason for dismissing you (obviously this depends on what you're being accused of!).

 

Your situation has seriously made me think again about the wisdom of joining a union - at least that way you would have a source of support solely for you.

 

I really hope it all gets sorted out - but I would really advise you to take a pessimistic view that it won't just blow over. Get some advice about what you should do next and try your best not to get bullied into doing anything or signing anything just to get it dealt with quickly.

 

Good luck.

 

Maz

[hali]

as Maz says get advice i woulnt 'just write an apology letter'

 

take care of yourself

[Andreamay]

if you are in the pla couldnt you ring lawcall for advise it is free and we found them very helpful surely they arent just there for the committee? you will need the pla number possibly.

[narnia]

In my (bitter)experience, the PLSA Lawcall is for the employer (ie, the committee)only, as they are the ones paying for the service.They will only help you if the committee ask a question on your behalf, or authorise it.

DO NOT write anything, apology or not, without sound advice, and CAB are probably your best bet,unless you join a union,who will help you.And, do not leave!! You have staff who are willing to support you and that is worth a kings ransome.............and worth more than any of us can say to you,as they are there with you and know what's going on.I really wish you luck with this issue.

[Rea]

I wrote an open letter to the committee a few years ago after they allowed a disgruntled parent to use our summer fayre meeting as a sounding board for everything she didnt like about me and the staff. I appologised for not being able to help the parent, advised everyone that when the correct procedures are followed and the correct people spoken to these problems dont arise and ended by supporting my staff against whom some horrible things had been said. The parent left and the committee never mentioned it again.

Make sure you note in any letter why you are writing it, what prompted you and how you regret that things got to such a pass that a friendly, professional discussion couldnt have dispelled the need for a letter.

I hope it all goes well for you, be strong, and remember we're all here for you.

[Guest]

Lots of sound advice, agree with Debs about what did the PLSA actually say to the committee. Also what seems to have been lost in all this is the original behaviour of the staff member!!

 

A speedy resolve would be in the best interest of everyone, having this hang over you over Xmas is awful, but please try your best to set it asie as you go home on the last day of term. ( easy for me to say I know).

 

CAB or Union is definately a must, note down every conversation ( even past ones that you haven't yet noted down) and definately no letter of apology. Like you say the Committee seem to be enjoying the drama, remember that the actual disciplinary subject was the way you disciplined a member of staff, to take such an issue so far is 'over the top'. The committee didn't follow the correct procedures in the first place by not investigating the initial complaint by the member of staff appropriately,about how you 'allegedly' spoke to her, they did not follow a grievance procedure when the staff made her complaint. Anything that has been said since the incident is in effect bad practice from the committee, they are in effect using procedure ( by threatening procedure against you) to 'bully' you, as by their previous non use of procedure (staffs' complaint) shows that the committee do not use policy/procedure consistently or appropriately. The fact is by not using the grievance procedure initially they have contravened your employment contract agreement and this could be construed as harrassment towards you.

 

If I were you I would get advice, keep to the facts of procedure that should have been and is now due to be commenced, and focus on this rather than the actual context of the complaint against you. ( hope that makes sense). I would not undertake any more comment or discussion on this matter with the committee, the ball is now in their court, be silent as to how you will be responding to any action they may take, just be prepared with the facts which in my eyes are heavily stacked against the committee over this whole situation.

 

I was surprised to read that there is no written constitution and I am a bit puzzled as to how this may affect ( or not) this situation, I've never come across a committee set up that has no constitution, this needs to be mentioned to CAB/Union or whoever you speak to for advice.

 

Best wishes, please try hard not to take this home with you over the holidays, it may help to write on a piece of paper 'Committee', place it in a draw or somewhere at work and lock it away as you leave the building at end of term, leaving this situation 'physically' at work.

 

Peggy

[Guest]

Thank you all for advice, I am not allowed to see the letter but have been accused of shouting at the member of staff and therefore bullying her. Luckily two staff were witness to the fact I didn't shout but they haven't bothered to ask staff yet. I wish I had joined a union, you just never think you will need to at the time.

[HappyMaz]

It is very fortunate that you have staff witnesses - and presumably they are prepared to confirm that you didn't shout at the staff member? Its shocking that the committee haven't followed any disciplinary procedures, and have allowed you to be intimidated and bullied in the hope that you will apologise for something that you clearly didn't do. This would put the committee in a very vulnerable position should you decide to claim constructive dismissal at an industrial tribunal - not that I'm suggesting this is a viable way to end this sorry saga especially as you have worked so hard to get this group to where it is today in terms of standards etc.

 

The fact that there is no constitution is serious too - and once your situation is sorted to a satisfactory conclusion this will need to be tackled as a matter of urgency. The lack of a constitution undermines everything the group attempts to do - both in terms of leadership and management and in meeting legal obligations and individual responsibilities, I would have thought. Presumably the PLA will have picked this up and will be advising how to handle it.

 

Good luck mcfletch - keep hanging in there and as Peggy says, try and put it into a little box for Christmas and enjoy some quality time away from the conflict.

 

Maz

[Guest]

The committee have given the member of staff x many working days to arrange a meeting regarding her grievance. The member of staff has not done this, although they know she received letter. The committee have now written to her offering her an appointment regarding the grievance, surely it would have been sufficient to let her contact them now, I think they just want me out and are hoping she will take grievance up or is this normal procedure?

Edited December 11, 2007 by mcfletch