Hi all

Have been talking today about preparing 'fruit and veg' at our village hall setting and have always understood that
a Food and Hygiene Certificate is not required but would show good practise. However, a suggestion was made that we ask parents to provide addtional foods for snack such as ham, cheese, bread sticks, pitta bread etc. Does anyone know if members of staff would need a food and hygiene certificate to handle such foods?

Apologies - just realised I put my last post in the wrong area can someone move it for me
as I don't know how!

dottyp

You can't move it because you don't have the power, unlike me.

Don't worry if you put things in the wrong place - there is always someone helpful around to help out.

and it is often Beau..

we supply all of the above mentioned and good practice is to have 1 staff trained and then cascade down to other staff, which is waht we did.. assume you are registered with environmental health already... (not that we ever saw anyone from there, just as well the hall kitchen is not really correctly equipped )

Inge

Some of those foods are certainly "higher risk" than the fruit and veg - I think it is just seen as good practice to send staff on this training, not a requirement, but I always sent all of my staff as part of their induction and had that written in my food hygiene policy.

[quote name='Beau' date='Apr 1 2009, 19:35' post='187267']
You can't move it because you don't have the power, unlike me.

Hi Beau

You are indeed a 'saint and moderator' - was beginning to panic

Thank you all for such quick replies - will seek out volunteers to attend a course after Easter

It is not a requirement as such but fits into a few of the welfare requirements of the EYFS so is suggested at least one person has the training. If you are going to book people on the course be quick in my area the courses become full very quickly.

samfrostie

dottyp, we are just about to purchase a CDROM based food hygiene training package which is able to be used by all staff and volunteers for the setting on one site licence. I read about it on here and have had it checked out by our LA food Safety team as I was wary of buying something which Ofsted said was not suitable. It turns out the Food Safety team are very happy with it and the advantages are the cost (under £50) and the fact that all adults who need to do it can complete it in their own time. We intend to ask all our regular emergency parent helpers to do the training so they can help out at snack time when they are helping out in the setting. If it's ok to say the company is called learnhq.com

I had the local enviromental officer turn up this week to check our kitchen - you need to have the safer food better business booklet and complete the details in there.

Apparently a section on training etc - my staff are all trained as our local LA offers online courses.

Check was much stricter than last time (I'm in a community hall and only provide snacks, but he was very tough). Children Centre manager got bit tutts and moaned at because her milk for her coffee was out of date.

Thanks Holly35 and tess - more very useful info. Will go onto web site for on line training as it would be ideal for
all staff to have training without having to find cover during session time.

dottyp

Hi Holly
Can you tell me where you got the CD Rom from and how much it cost - Thanks

It is from learnhq.com and costs just under £50 for one site licence. As I say I have checked with Ofsted who don't commit themselves (hey what's new?), LA and the food safety team in our LA environmental health service. I wanted something in writing which said it was suitable as price wise it was loads cheaper than LA training.

We operate from a village hall too and have just had our enironmental health inspection. As well as checking the fridge temp and that food was in date etc she wated to check our H & S policy, manual handling and risk assessments etc whch all got a bit confusing as it wasn't clear whether she was inspecting the hall (as I thought) but also Pre school practices.

At least it has got the hall committee worried and at last motivated to do something about the cleaner who doesn't actually seem to clean anything (it has emerged she doesn't even clean the toilets!); to get somone in to do a major clean and to redecorate the kitchen. Hopefully it won't mean a rent increase.

One of my staff has done Food Hygiene training and cascaded it down to the rest of us (we only prepare snacks) but maybe we should all do it.

environmental health check is now fro the group not just the premises, so yes they will check your policies etc as well as the state of the area you use..

dread them going into kitchen I just left.. it would fail definitely.. you cannot use the hand washing sink without turning on the water in the main sink first! It is clean only because we clean it.. and inside the cupboards which are not ours... YUK!

Inge

i hold the level2 food and hygiene cert and pass on info to staff and parent helpers who then sign to say they understand and have had training

milk and cheese are high risk and i would not ask parents to bring in those items and you cannot be sure how they have been stored prior to arriving to you.
i also had to write a giudance down from what we clean with to where food is purchased and stored prior to coming into school, this was done with our environmental health officer who ins[ected us he was great and a mind of info

From EYFS Welfare Requirements

Legal Requirement
"Those responsible for the preparation and handling of food must be competent to do so"

I work at a sessional pre-schol playgroup, mornings only - when I queried this with our Early Years Advisory team they said that it meant that anyone who prepared snacks eg slices of fruit, toast, crackers etc had to have Food Hygiene training.

So off all 7 staff members went for a full days training on a Saturday - what joy!!!

and when will you all have to do it again?

Since my last post my 'safer food - better business booklet arrived' not so much a booklet as a huge folder.

Has sections to complete at the front where you have to state how you deal with food prep etc and a huge diary to complete at the back each day.

Thanks for that tess!! By interest, where did you apply for a copy of the safer food, better business 'folder' ?

dottyp

Hi i rang the local council who advised me with some paperwork to fill in and also went on food standard agency website both very helpfull... also recomended one member of staff on course for food hygiene then they can feed back to all memebers.. Hope thats of some help xx

Thank you so much for this info. - we haven't undertaken any training - have to say it's surely basic common sense - we are mums and grannies - haven't poisoned our families (yet!) - still I will look into training opportunities - don't know when we will find the time do it - in our sleep perhaps!

Sunnyday

Our early years advisor told us anyone handling food had to have basic food hygiene, even to remove a yoghurt lid ! never heard of anything so daff ! but there you go.

So all six member of staff are now slogging their way through a food hygiene book and when we have finished we will all sit down and do an exam paper.

Soooo looking forward to that when we get back to work but I suppose it must be done ! mind you nearly choked when our chairperson told us we had to do it in our own time as it would be a benefit to us ! You can imagine what sort of a replly she got !

Motherclangerx

3 years time

To be honest it was way over the top for what we have to do - we were also told to get the 'Safer food better business' guidance too, and as mentioned it's a huge folder which we've 'filed' in the kitchen!!

ooops just checked when I done mine.....2003!
Great something else to arrange and put myself through!

Teaching unions advising teachers not to do the certificate???

Well a school near me said only some of the TA's would do it as the teachers have nothing to do with food preparation. Mind you this is reception upwards. I am a nursery teacher and I have done the training against the wishes of my HT as I had to stress that I prepare snacks, do baking, supervise others doing snacks including students. I just felt that I also needed to know the exact examples of good practice so I could pass these on.

Sue

there's always this

educare

Thats not what we were told and the environmental man said what we had done was good, he even helped me word the training for staff
I have parent (regulars) help with snack and they have had the same training as my staff

Thanks Cait!

Sunnyday

That's who we use. It's not a bit stressful, you can do it in your own time

How long does it take to do Cait? Am trying to weigh up the cost of paying the staff member to attend a free training course (albeit on a Saturday) and paying the staff member to do the course at home!

Maz

Our Early Years team recommend the lead person (ie owner/manager) does the training and then cascades this down to those who prepare snack to ensure they are competent. The Legal Requirement doesn't actually state that everyone must receive official training, just that the registered person makes sure they have the skills and are competent to do so.

I think its a case of interpretation, really.

Maz

there's 4 units (I think 4?) and multiple choice questions for each unit, so it kind of takes as long as she wants really!

was beginning to worry then happy maz but that is exactly how we went about it

I ordered the disc yesterday- i got an email with the link today and cd is in the post.
I completed the test this afternoon took me an hour - I passed and printed off my certificate straight away.
Cost £49.99
Took about an hour and now my other staff can do it in their own time

So cheaper to go on the course then (from the setting's point of view anyway). Or does the £49.99 mean that the whole staff team can do it? My brain has officially turned to mush!

Maz

Yes we have a disc for the setting and all the staff can do it - so I think its cheaper and def more convinient

And is there an expiry date? This would definitely be cheaper and every new staff member could do it as part of their induction!

Result!

Maz

Im not sure - I will check the info that comes with the cd. It did say that they regularly update their training materials.

Excellent!

It would seem that this is the way forward with this then.

Sunnyday

I have the same disk and I am under the impression that there is no expiry date for using it. As everyone has said it certainly seems to be the way forwrd with regards to cost and time efficiency.

Cait - I've just received an email from a company offering online food hygiene courses (as well as lots of others). They also allow you to view a sample of their courses (you need to give your contact details before you can access it). I was wondering how the course compares to the educare one...?

Here's a link to their home page - they also offer e-learning courses on manual handling for childcare workers too!

Maz

Just found the foodstandards guide here:

http://www.food.gov.uk/foodindustry/regula...b/sfbbcaterers/

looks quite useful

The food one looks quite good, it seems to cover all the same things but with a site licence it's cheaper. I think we were paying that per person with educare

Is the educare one as gimmicky though? I kept expecting that chef to start speaking to me with a Swedish accent like the Muppet Show!

No, educare one seems dead serious in comparison, definitely no 'hurdy heedy'

After my last post, and checking out all the requirements, just read that after washing up plates and cups etc we are required to:

"Leave to air dry, or dry with a clean disposable cloth."

Does that mean the tea towels are banned?

The one you have posted a link to has been given the seal of approval by our Food Safety Team at the LA. We have used it for 2/3 staff so far and they all said it was quick and simple to use.

Which link, holly35: the educare one or the Learn HQ one?

Maz